You Betta Recognize, Part 2: White Male-Dominated Law Enforcement Is The Only Thing Standing Between You And Mass Rape In Black Neighborhoods

AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMEN ARE THE ONLY ONES WORRIED ABOUT “FIGHTING THE POWER.” THIS HASN’T WORKED OUT VERY WELL FOR US.

Welcome to the second installment of what will be an ongoing You Betta Recognize series of posts. The first installment was an earlier post explaining why those African-American women who want to survive and thrive need to delete the phrase “fighting White hegemony” from their vocabulary. As I said there,

White hegemony is currently feeding all African-Americans. To put it bluntly, White people feed all of us. Directly or indirectly. We need to stop “tripping” about that. Very few African-Americans have ever been serious about building the infrastructure needed in order to be a self-sufficient people. Only marginalized groups among us like the Nation of Islam went so far as to actually cultivate farm land, and create grocery stores and restaurants to feed African-Americans.

Nobody except African-American women is sacrificing anything in order to “fight” White hegemony. Including the Black men who flap their lips talking about White hegemony. Many of the Black men talking that stuff are busy dating, sexing and marrying the so-called “evil White man’s” daughters. These men are busy transferring whatever wealth they can accumulate back to the so-called “evil White man” through his daughter. If not the so-called “evil White man’s” daughters, then these Black men talking that stuff are looking to transfer whatever wealth they get to other types of non-Black women.

No other race or ethnic group of women are even worrying about “fighting White hegemony,” except African-American women. When you’re the only one doing something, that’s usually a clue that whatever you’re doing is a bad idea. Other women, including other types of Black women from around the world, are too busy making sure that they (directly or indirectly) get a slice from the current, status quo “White hegemony pie” by marrying whichever man will bring the most to their table. Including qualified White men.

I would suggest that anyone who’s conflicted or confused about the idea of dropping this phrase from their mind consider the following observations I made about activist Black women’s lifestyles during this post.

For Black men, political activism is a vehicle for getting their personal needs met—a source of getting paid and getting laid. Much like the ministry. All on their terms. For example, has Rev. Jesse Jackson ever worked at a job?

Think about the roster of married Black male activists who were promiscuous womanizers such as Dr. King, Elijah Muhammad, and so on. These men had the pleasures of a home life with a wife sitting at home waiting for them, and plentiful sex on the side with female groupies. Think about the single Black male activists who were promiscuous womanizers such the Panthers and others who had a steady, non-stop supply of female groupies they were having sex with. On top of this, Black male activists are typically treated as celebrities and showered with adulation. For Black men, activism is often a vehicle for fulfilling their (financial) safety and belongingness and love needs (intimacy of all sorts, including sexual intimacy).

In short, Black male activists routinely get their personal needs met. Every. Step. Of. The. Way. Meanwhile, activism does not provide the same perks for Black women who are working as hard and facing the same pressures and dangers.

ACTIVISM DOES NOT PROVIDE SIMILAR “ROCK STAR” PERKS FOR BLACK WOMEN ACTIVISTS—NOR DOES IT DO ANYTHING TO MEET THEIR BASIC PERSONAL NEEDS

Activism does not provide the same perks for Black women. While it may provide higher-level needs for women, it generally won’t do anything to provide the foundational second and third-level needs.

While keeping the hierarchy of needs in mind, I invite you to do what we rarely do: Consider some of the inner lives of the crusading, activist African-American women that we hold up as Black History Month heroines. If your thinking is similar to mine, you won’t be pleased by much of what you see. I’ll just name a couple of examples. Dorothy Height has never married. Mary McLeod Bethune separated from her husband (who died in 1918). She never remarried, and she passed away in 1955. These women came of age during an era when marriage was the norm for Black women and readily available within the African-American collective. Who, if anybody, did these women come home to for all those decades?

Consider the personal horrors of being married to a Black male activist like Dr. King. He was often away from home. Coretta Scott King was also in great physical danger—and living alone for long stretches of time with their children. She was responsible for holding down the fort, and child care while he was away. If she was faithful in her marriage, that meant she went through long stretches of not having sex while he was away. Meanwhile, Dr. King was having sex with his women on the side. I won’t even mention the female Black Power activists who apparently served as “booty calls” (and worse) for male Black Power activists.

For Black women, activism does not provide the perks it often provides for Black men. No free money. No husband to remain faithful to you while you sleep around with other men. No adoring harem of male groupies. The only woman I can think of that “had it like that” was a White author named Ayn Rand. Apparently for a number of Black women, crusading activism was a dead-end leading to an asexual, ascetic lifestyle. Who wants that, except a nun?

From what I can tell, one of the relatively few “Black History Month Heroines” that appears to have been involved in activism while also making sure to get her personal needs met (the way she wanted) was Lorraine Hansberry. She was a bisexual or lesbian who married (either out of genuine love for her White husband, or to use him as a voluntary or involuntary cover story), while still dating and sleeping with women.

Dorothy Height has passed away (at age 98) since I wrote that post. She never married.

WHITE MALE-DOMINATED LAW ENFORCEMENT IS ONE OF THE POWERS THAT AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMEN CALL THEMSELVES FIGHTING. FOR OUR OWN SURVIVAL, WE NEED TO RETHINK THAT.

Halima, blog host of Black Women’s Interracial Relationship Circle, graciously gave me permssion to quote the comment that a reader made during a recent conversation at her blog.

Icon said…
“Ungrateful American BW need to be thanking their lucky stars that the White man keeps Black men in control. B/C where there is no white male rule the Black men are running crazy and the poor BW and their kids who have to live near and with them are experiencing EXTREME suffering.” [Khadija speaking: Icon is quoting this statement from another reader in the same thread.]

A tough pill to swallow, but a necessary pill to swallow nonetheless. If NOT for the white cops and prison system in America, where I’m from, there’d be total anarchy, public rape, shooting for not responding to harassment and/or “punishment by gang rape” etc., if black men were allowed to actually FULLY control and operate black American neighborhoods. If black men could, we’d have precisely the same “community” as the Congo and South Africa where repeated rape of everyone from infants to old women running rampant, drug wars and shoot outs by militias CONSTANTLY (where now, as soon as a shoot out occurs, someone calls the cops and it’s squashed), etc.

I agree, we are EXTREMELY privileged as People of African Descent in Predominately White Countries (PODnPWC will be my henceforth abbreviation :-P). And every black woman that walks around hating white men and defending black men should know exactly what our circumstances would be if not for WM laws keeping black men in check. It is, truly, a hard pill to swallow.

Icon is absolutely correct. It’s very similar to the bitter reality of what women’s lives are like in Muslim-dominated countries. I’ve never been silly enough to want to live in a Muslim country.

WE’VE SEEN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WHITE MALE-DOMINATED LAW ENFORCEMENT PULLS BACK FROM POLICING AFRICAN-AMERICAN RESIDENTIAL AREAS: DUNBAR VILLAGE.

We know what happens when White male-dominated law enforcement pulls back from policing Black residential areas in the US. Dunbar Village. Rowan Towers. We also know that many (if not most) African-Americans (of both genders) are indifferent to these sorts of atrocities, as long as it’s not happening to them personally.

A SIMILAR, SYSTEMATIC PATTERN OF ATROCITIES AGAINST WOMEN AND GIRLS HAPPENS IN BLACK-LED COUNTRIES.

It’s not a coincidence that so many of the countries listed as the 10 worst places in the world to live if you are a woman are Black countries. I’m not surprised by the list. The same way I wasn’t surprised to read this news story about the need for women-only food coupons because young Haitian men were stealing the food aid. The same way I wasn’t surprised to later read this report about how Haitian men are busy raping women in the camps for people who were displaced by the earthquake several months ago.

In fairness, men do this sort of thing in disaster situations throughout the world (seize the aid meant for starving women and children). Black men are not alone in attacking women and girls. What’s unique about the Black world is the total absence of a countervailing set of male protectors. Including the total absence of flawed male protectors who, even though they are basically predatory, still protect and provide for the women and children within their particular fiefdoms.

In other places like Afghanistan and so on, there are often male counterweights to the male thieves. Such as imams, sheiks, and the tribal warlords who also steal the food aid. But these other types of men (while also stealing the food aid for themselves) typically make sure that the women and children within their fiefdoms eat!

RECOGNIZE THAT AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMEN HAVE NO ORGANIZED MALE PROTECTORS OTHER THAN WHITE MALE-DOMINATED LAW ENFORCEMENT.

With the limited exception of the Nation of Islam, there generally are no organized group of male protectors within Black residential neighborhoods. The masses of African-American men assume no responsibility whatsoever for protecting the women and children in their neighborhoods. That’s why deeply confused African-American women, such as the Deborah movement in Chicago try to take on the male duty of protecting Black residential areas. White male-dominated law enforcement is the only thing currently standing between the Black women and girls who live in Black neighborhoods and mass rape. More African-American women need to remember that before having knee-jerk anti-police reactions.

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53 Responses to “You Betta Recognize, Part 2: White Male-Dominated Law Enforcement Is The Only Thing Standing Between You And Mass Rape In Black Neighborhoods”

  1. Neecy says:

    Khadija,

    I for the life of me cannot understand why American BW don’t get this. I had written the first part of the response that Icon responded to. Its juts bizarre that American BW refuse to see the writing on the wall. They talk about WM this and that. YET, its the WM who has put laws in place to protect women and children or rather PUNISH those who commit crimes against women and children.

    How many Black nations do this? Its all about the males. Like I also mentioned, its not that WM are not sexist, or not predators or don’t commit crimes against women and children, but the fact that as you said, there are enough White male protectors to police and punish the males who commit such atrocities against women and children. You mainly see this in more White male dominated societies, than you do of any other cultures. It may not be an easy thing to admit for many people, but it is what it is. Yet when you tell these complaining ungrateful BW who are always screaming about how wonderful the Black man is, how victimized he is, and how tired they are of the White evil devil punishing him (for nothing) to go live in a Black country or nation if they are that fed up with White male laws and hegemony, they look at you like you’re speaking anything but English and suddenly you hear birds chirping in the background. Lol They know the truth but are too stubborn to admit it.

  2. ann says:

    The Deborah Movement…we will defend our neighbors when the men want. How embrassing is this.

  3. Neecy,

    You said, “I for the life of me cannot understand why American BW don’t get this. I had written the first part of the response that Icon responded to. Its juts bizarre that American BW refuse to see the writing on the wall. They talk about WM this and that. YET, its the WM who has put laws in place to protect women and children or rather PUNISH those who commit crimes against women and children.”

    One, African-American women are still doing the blind, knee-jerk BM protectionism that dates back from the era of slavery and lynching. They haven’t taken a moment to reevaluate their circumstances in 21st century America. Two, it wasn’t so much that WM created women’s much greater physical safety and freedom in the West—feminist WW did that. The same feminist WW that AA women like to demonize are the ones primarily responsible for the better lives we enjoy as women living here in the West (which are better than we would enjoy in any other part of the world).
    ___________________________________________

    Ann,

    Yeah, that Deborah Movement mess is downright embarrassing on so many levels. About the Deborah Mess, I’ll just repeat what I said when a reader first brought it to my attention a while back,

    My mouth dropped open when I first read that news story. Without being familiar with the Bible, I had the feeling that what these women are doing CAN’T possibly be the biblically correct answer! Especially given the fact that they want to hold everybody “accountable” EXCEPT the violent criminals who are killing all these people in their neighborhood(s). How these women managed to interpret an Old Testament section of the Bible . . . which is apparently chock full of accounts of the Israelites KILLING large numbers of their enemies—including the members of a corrupt Israelite tribe (the tribe of Benjamin)— into a rationale for protecting violent criminals (from being effectively policed) is far beyond my understanding. I’ll eventually get around to asking my friend (who is a Christian minister) about all of this. {shaking my head in amazement}

    . . . I’m still flabbergasted by this news story, and I don’t think I’m going to get over that sensation. I keep clicking back to look at the photo that goes with that news story: “I am Deborah & I protect my community” {shaking my head in amazement}

    . . . Yes, indeed. I wonder what goes through these women’s heads as they march past the legions of passive, NON-protector and NON-provider, “good” adult AA males who live in that neighborhood.

    {sarcasm on} To quote the reaction of a reader named Omi (from the conversation immediately preceding this one)—I suppose all of this means that these particular BW in that neighborhood “know a lot of the wrong brothas.” {sarcasm off}

    I also don’t understand how they believe that a mass of women marching around carrying signs saying “I am Deborah & I protect my community” is going to stop the brutal attacks and MURDERS in that neighborhood. Who is that message (on their signs) directed to? And how is that message supposed to stop the killers from continuing their killing spree? I just don’t get it.

    . . . the mental gymnastics involved in this “I am Deborah” mess are amazing. Another “speed bump” to my comprehension of their action is how they managed to get this idea from that part of the Bible. Like the Quran and the Torah, the Bible is a fairly violent text. The Bible also recommends that the Israelites engage in ethnic cleansing and atrocities such as took place in Bosnia during the break-up of Yugoslavia. My point is that these Bible stories usually do NOT include soft and tender handling of the Israelites’ enemies—such folks usually end up DEAD. And the slaying of such folks is typically praised in the Bible.

    I’ll ultimately get around to reading through Judges and talk to my friend the minister. But from a quick glance at all of that, it would seem to me that the violent BM criminals that these women are shielding from the National Guard are akin to the corrupt Israelite tribe mentioned during that passage. The corrupt tribe of Benjamin that the other Israelites turned on—and in the account, they K-I-L-L-E-D thousands of these corrupt tribesmen as recompense for their corruption. Part of said corruption apparently involved these corrupt tribesmen gang raping and killing some man’s concubine.

    How these women twisted all of this around into a message to reject armed security (the National Guard) being brought in to protect THEM and THEIR children is beyond me. I keep harping on this particular point because it reminds me of a critique that Malcolm X made about so many AA Christians of his era—too many of them interpreted their Bible in a way that justified their cowardice and the status quo. That’s what I see happening here.

    . . . **Reader’s Note**

    I just realized that I didn’t mention where I got the “these Deborah movement women don’t want effective security” impression from. The reader who informed me about the news story had forwarded to me an announcement sent out by some of the Deborah movement organizers. In part, it said:

    “Deborahs are encouraged to:

    1) Join us at an elementary school to mentor young girls on Friday, May 7, 2010. Please call [I deleted this info] at [...] for more information.

    2) Join us at Operation PUSH on Saturday, May 8, 2010, at 10:00 am, 950 West 50th Street, Chicago, Illinois for a Women Against Violence Rally.

    3) Join us at a Mother’s Day Rally at Brainerd Park, 1246 West 92nd Street, Chicago, Illinois, on Sunday, May 9, 2010 at 1:30 pm to organize mothers and women to stop violence among our children and in our communities.

    4) Join us on Monday, May 10, 2010 at 7:00 pm, at a meeting being convene by State Representative LaShawn Ford to tell him that we need jobs and resources more than we need the National Guard in Chicago. Please call [..] at [..] for more information.

    5) Join us on Wednesday, May 12, 2010, at 6:00 pm at 3509 South King Drive to board a bus to visit Gary, Indiana where a 5 year old boy was beaten to death and to join Deborahs from Gary, East Chicago and Hammond who are also fed up with the death and destruction of Black children.”

    . . . Yes, I believe any sensible person would run for their lives and leave those neighborhoods. I know it’ll sound cold as ice, but I don’t necessarily want these Deborah movement women to leave those areas. Since they’re that misguided, perhaps it’s safer for the rest of us that they DON’T leave and come among more normal people. I’m sure that these types of women would destroy any sanctuary by bringing their DBRBM sons, nephews, cousins and boyfriends with them to any new setting.

    {still shaking my head}

    . . . I believe that this reaction is the fruit of incidents like the Scottsboro case, lynchings, Rosa Parks’ arrest, etc. That widespread, historical experience of oppression by a racist court system taught AAs to view AA defendants as something like political prisoners.

    The problem is that this view of AA defendants is OBSOLETE. The court system is still utterly racist through and through. However, the defendants are ALSO racist (most Black underclass defendants that I’ve observed have a deep and abiding hatred for other Black people—which they express in their behavior), vicious and violent—through and through.

    I will add that most AAs have no real sense of reality about the court system. I’m not bothered by its racism—because from what I’ve read there’s NO “better” court system in any other country. Similar to our whining about the public schools**, what most AAs don’t realize is that most other court systems—including those in civilized, stable countries like the UK and France—DON’T coddle defendants as much as the US courts.

    [**Most countries on this planet DON'T have totally free public school systems. In most countries, parents can't do what the majority of AAs do---use the public schools as a free babysitting service and make no investment whatsoever in their children's education. In most countries around the world, parents have to pay school fees, school uniform fees, etc. AAs complain about so many things without realizing that they would be even worse off in other countries. So many AAs are totally out of touch with reality.]

    In some Western European countries, there’s no concept of bail/bond—they’ll get around to your case, whenever they get around to it. And you wait in jail until they get around to it. In some Western European countries, there’s no concept of the adversarial system. Instead, cases are perceived as a joint search for “the truth” by both sides. Well, this wouldn’t work out very well for the bulk of defendants—who are generally guilty. [If not guilty of what they were arrested for, then guilty of something else. People don't automatically get arrested the very first time they do something wrong.]

    So, my issue isn’t so much with racism in the court system—that’s to be found anywhere. My issue is with the sanctimonious hypocrisy of the US court system. Other places’ court systems don’t tell so many lies regarding their operations. They don’t pretend to be about “equal justice, yadda, yadda, yadda.” So everybody’s on notice in other countries that you really need to stay OUT of the courts.

    Various players in the US court system claim to be so much better than other places, and they’re not. If they just ‘fessed up and told people up front what the real deal is in terms of court, then I wouldn’t have a problem. Fair warning and notice.

    Although, I will add that AAs want to have it both ways: We’ve been whining for almost a century about the racism of the US court system. But yet we act shocked and surprised when we do things to end up in the court system and are hit with racism-based enhanced penalties for our actions. Well, since we already know it’s racist, we can’t then seriously “clutch our pearls” in horror and claim to be surprised when it does something racist.

    . . . Well, I know that God does NOT endorse stupidity. And what these self-proclaimed “Deborahs” are doing is just so idiotic on so many levels that it could NOT have been rooted in scripture. This brings me to the next point: What has to happen for these Sista Soldiers (religious and secular) to get it through their heads that women are NOT supposed to be fighting on the front lines?!

    On the one hand, these particular Deborah fools at least realize that they’re fighting alone—without BM. They’re not hallucinating about that aspect of what’s going on. Some other BF Sista Soldier fools actually believe that there’s a cadre of BM fighting alongside of them. {more head shaking}

    . . . No matter how much the Sista Soldiers want to pretend, it is unheard of throughout human history for women to form the bulk of the troops on the front lines.

    **CRITICIZING A SACRED COW ALERT** I believe the normalizing of this “BW on the front lines” madness was one of several extremely negative, unintended consequences of the manner in which the Civil Rights Movement was conducted. Even as a preteen, I’ve always had deep misgivings about the cowardly decision to throw defenseless BW and Black children on the front lines to face off against rabid Bull Connors, etc. This “Deborah” mess is one particularly rotten fruit from that long-ago tree.

    . . . “Peace wall”-type police barricades will be placed around violent Black residential areas. This is what Karen has been savvy enough to mention during earlier conversations at the previous blog. Yes, indeed, these walls WILL ultimately go up. And then “the Deborahs” and assorted other foolish BW—and their helpless children—will literally be trapped FOR REAL in close proximity to the violent DBRBM that they want to coddle.

    Not to mention that these DBRBM’s savage attacks on others, like the murders of Asians mentioned earlier will ENSURE that NOBODY else cares about law-abiding AAs who will be walled together with the violent DBR AAs.

    Expect Success!

    • ann says:

      Today, my cousin whom I wrote about earlier bought me to the site of her new home she would like to build. The plot of land is in a small rural town. She would like for her kids to enjoy the country life, no problem there. The two blocks near her proposed home is quite; however, walk further down the street into the third and four blocks and it will make one think of a future ghetto. There are a few men milling about, this is country life? She can keep it. There is only one way in and one way out and she must pass some of those cluttered looking houses. She has three kids and there will be no close family members in case of an emergency. Her 82 y.o. grandmother has been telling her not to move there. LOL, she keeps telling me to move there because I can get a mortgage around $500. The house could be free I do not want to live in a future ghetto. As we were leaving I pointed to a sign that read “Emergency Sand”, I asked her did the area flood and she was not sure. Red Flag, this is a big mistake.

    • calpurnia says:

      We dont need a ‘Deborah movement. We need Christian men who will become missionaries and mentor these boys. They don’t have to go overseas. It’s best if they live there temporarily like in the overseas nations. That’s the only way it will change

  4. More about the Deborah Movement Mess:

    During the earlier conversation about the Deborhah Movement mess, a reader named PioneerValleyWoman explained a sensible reading of that particular Biblical episode when she said,

    Regarding the “Deborahs,” I went and re-read the book of judges to see where she was mentioned, and these women are just not reading it correctly, and you called it, even though you had not read the book and are not even a Christian!

    So what happened in the book. It is true, Deborah was a leader of her people, a prophetess, but she inspired the men to act and vanquish the enemies of her people. She inspired the men who would lead the armies. She prophesied that the general of their enemies’ army would be undone by a woman. But he was not undone by a woman who fought him in a public battle. She used a stealth strategy of seeming to help him when he was in need, ie., after his army had been vanquished–she gave him water and then let him rest. Once he fell asleep, she killed him.

    So if these Deborahs want to get it right, this is what it would look like.

    A Rev. Mama figure on a stage, ie., someone like the late Dorothy Height, surrounded by MEN; she would be introducing the young men who would be the leaders in fighting the battle.

    That would be the public face of the strategy. if the Deborahs insisted that they wanted to be like those ancient women of the Old Testament, they would need something more.

    The behind the scenes strategy would entail identifying some stone-serious (and brave) women to do battle behind the scenes in a stealth strategy. Here I’m thinking of a “honey trap,” where a woman would be brought in to seduce and then set up a man for his destruction.

    This is far more biblical than what these Deborahs are imagining–there are countless stories in the bible of women using the “honey trap.”

    Expect Success!

  5. Zoopath says:

    I’ve got it: A version of the bed intruder song that addresses the need for white-male dominated law enforcement! That would dovetail nicely.

  6. pioneervalleywoman says:

    Greetings, Khadija!

    Thanks for the shout-out! Your post brought me back a ways, to the last time I heard any black woman mouth that nonsense about white male-dominated law enforcement.

    Ah yes, Baby-Girl Black Nationalist who was in my Af-Am Studies class some years ago. She explained one day that she grew up “in the hood” and that “in the hood,” the police are not friends; black children are socialized to realize that from the time they are small.

    It is true, the police are not the friends of the criminals, but is that the case for everyone? So if the police are not friends, who are? Who is the friend of the victimized black person? The local Rev. who will urge forgiveness without punishment? The local Rev. who will urge the police to be lenient, that we have to protect the victimizers over the victimized?

    I suppose that if I want to hear that sort of rhetoric again, I’ll have to listen to Rev. Hot Comb’s radio show and shut it off when it gets to be too much!

  7. Zoopath,

    There’s a “bed intruder” song? And, presumably, this “bed intruder” song is popular? :-(

    Never mind. . . I don’t need or want to know. . .
    __________________________________________________

    Greetings, PioneerValleyWoman!

    You said, “Your post brought me back a ways, to the last time I heard any black woman mouth that nonsense about white male-dominated law enforcement.

    Ah yes, Baby-Girl Black Nationalist who was in my Af-Am Studies class some years ago. She explained one day that she grew up “in the hood” and that “in the hood,” the police are not friends; black children are socialized to realize that from the time they are small.”

    What’s interesting about that exchange you had with Baby-Girl Foolish Nationalist is that I never made blanket assumptions about the police. Not even when I was in my Black Nationalist trance.

    I never made those blanket condemnations of the police for the same reasons why I’ve never completely dismissed the “old head” leadership such as Rev. Baby Daddy or Rev. Hot Comb. I’ve vehemently criticized them when they did something wrong; but I’ve never made a blanket dismissal of them. It would be foolish to completely throw away Rev. Baby Daddy and Rev. Hot Comb because there’s still a need for them. Crossover Negro Politicians never respond when nooses are left at your work station. You can’t ask Crossover Negro Politicians for help with racist attacks because they won’t respond.

    Well, it comes down to the same question with the police: Who else can you call—other than the WM-dominated police—when your so-called “brothas” beat, rob, rape and torture you?

    No matter what the ideology or belief system (before, during and after Black Nationalism; before and during Islam), I’ve always been focused on practical questions and solutions. And what Baby-Girl Foolish Nationalist was telling you was not practical. Certainly not for herself or the other BW in those neighborhoods who would be among the first to be attacked if the White police completely stopped policing “da hood.”

    Which leads to the next part of your comement where you said, “It is true, the police are not the friends of the criminals, but is that the case for everyone? So if the police are not friends, who are? Who is the friend of the victimized black person? The local Rev. who will urge forgiveness without punishment? The local Rev. who will urge the police to be lenient, that we have to protect the victimizers over the victimized?”

    Now THAT’S the question I always wanted to hear answers to: Who IS the friend of normal, self-respecting, often-victimized Black people?

    The reason why the Nation of Islam captured my attention during the time period of the news story I linked to in the post (late 1980s) is because they had positioned themselves as the ONLY true friend that normal, want-to-be-racially-self-respecting, and often-victimized Black people had! They were the ONLY ones during that era who took any sort of consistent action against the drug dealers; and this was during the height of the crack tsunami in AA residential areas.

    It’s a new day. The NOI is gone for all practical purposes; and they’ll surely disappear after Min. Farrakhan passes away. The existence (and lack of outrage about the existence) of the Deborah Movement mess has laid bare the fact that AA women and children have NO protectors whatsoever except WM-dominated police.

    Expect Success!

  8. halima says:

    Two, it wasn’t so much that WM created women’s much greater physical safety and freedom in the West—feminist WW did that.

    Khadija just read my mind lol!

    This is one instance where I am happy that white feminists are setting the agenda around DV, violence against women, rape etc etc. Could you imagine what would happen if bw were the lead group tasked with the reponsibility of putting together the current feminist/mainstream perspective on such issues! Lawdy Lawdy Lawdy is all I can say.

    there the criteria for what constitutes rape etc would be so narrow, 3/4 of black male and indeed all male rapist would get to escape conviction all because of bw bid to ‘free’ a brotha!

  9. Halima,

    You said, “This is one instance where I am happy that white feminists are setting the agenda around DV, violence against women, rape etc etc. Could you imagine what would happen if bw were the lead group tasked with the reponsibility of putting together the current feminist/mainstream perspective on such issues! Lawdy Lawdy Lawdy is all I can say.”

    Guuurl…you ain’t never lied. Oh, I can imagine what would happen: We, and our daughters, and our mothers, and our grandmothers would be repeatedly gang-raped—just like babies, toddlers, small girls, and women in the Congo, South Africa, and Haiti. {shudder}

    When it comes to any country that I’m living in, I pray that God NEVER allows Black folks (of either gender) to set any agenda whatsoever regarding domestic violence, rape, child molestation, etc.! It goes almost without saying that most BM don’t care about these issues. And most Black women are dangerously male-identified. Too many of us are the same as the Arab, Pakistani, and Afghan women who support so-called “honor killings.” Most BW support violence against other Black women and girls—as long as these attacks are committed by Black men (and not White men).

    You said, “there the criteria for what constitutes rape etc would be so narrow, 3/4 of black male and indeed all male rapist would get to escape conviction all because of bw bid to ‘free’ a brotha!”

    There wouldn’t be any convictions if it was left up to BW. We see the predator-protection that so many BW engage in regarding R.Kelly and Chris Brown. And I choose those two savage brutes as examples because of the photographic/video evidence that took their cases out of the so-called “he said, she said” category.

    I pray that God continues to allow White feminists to set the agenda around domestic violence, rape, child molestation, etc. It’s the only way that BW and children will have any measure of safety.

    Expect Success!

    • Truth P says:

      Khadija you are sooo right, for the most part AA women would not be allies for AAw and girls who are the victims of rape.I had conversations about this with a few AAW and you would not believe how many of them make victims out of the criminals.They wanted me to keep in mind a supposedly loooong list of black men falsely accused of rape .Meanwhile, most instances that I could see covered by the media that included black men falsely accused of rape involved WHITE women and black men.I’m just sayin, I don’t see AAw falsely accusing black men of rape in large numbers like white women but sometimes people,AAW and AAM,will omit that fact when discussing the issue of innocent black men in prison.I have no idea the numbers of aaw to white and other raced women that falsely accuse black men of crimes but I do find it hard to believe that women who take very real verbal and physical abuse by black men on a regular basis,who are also further harassed by black people if they tell, would be doing all this falsely accusing of black men.

      Furthermore, it is extremely hard for you to get it through AAM and AAW heads that statutory rape is wrong and detrimental to not only the mental health and physical well being of the child but that it also contributes to the number of AA’s in poverty,diseases in the bc etc.Try telling black folks that there is absolutley NO WAY we can really be anti poverty,anti OOw children and anti diseases and allow such high levels of statutory rape to continue.Many of these so called anti poverty,anti diseases people will give you a story about how their greatgrandma’s were married off to their older greatgrandpa’s when they were young.Welp the keyword there is married.Also Khadija my great grandma who is in her ninties married young ,lived in poverty,was sometimes abused and neglected by my great grandpa as were their children.

      Speaking of those Deborah women,I have been participating in Victims Of Crime meetings here where I live, i’d thought it’d be something good for me to participate in to help myself and others.The group is mostly women and we discuss alot of different topics. Well…rolling my eyes twisting my lips… our teacher is a Deborah/Sistah Soldier and is convinced we need to fight for black men.I’m there for self elevation and to help other women.I had been examining if I needed to leave the class as our views clash,no shouting matches or fights we just have differing views and are respectful towards one another in presenting them, but I realized that for the very most part this woman has some pearls of wisdom that I can use.I’m going to stay there, i’ll always offer up my differing pov when she speaks on our need to save the men.I won’t force anything on any of the women.I’ll let other women think for themselves but I am (taking what I need from this class and leaving the rest:)

      Sorry if I rambled too long Khadija.

      • TruthP.,

        You didn’t “ramble.” {smile}

        So, while under BF Deborah/Sista Soldier type of leadership, that Victims of Crime meeting is actually dedicated to championing the interests of BM criminals…Lord have mercy. {shaking my head}

        • Truth P. says:

          Khadija,Khadija,Khadija
          smh and (gasps for air)……okay it’s like this we have women in the group that were victimized by men, rape and other forms of violence, etc smh again but it seems that the woman doesn’t seem to look at this as one of the biggest issues these women face.For the most part the group has been focusing on prevention as far as not getting too worked up about things and yelling which can lead to violence.Many of us are learning more techniques on how to be slow to anger and slow to speak.I joined because I felt this was something I could use in dealing with my siblings. i’m generally very kind to outsiders but I’m partially responsible for my siblings and they can be disobedient sometimes and i’m sick of yelling.The determining factor for me to stay in the group was that she does teach women what to look for BEFORE they enter into relationships with men.She tells them to take it slow.She knows that some men are abusive and she encourages women to not go out with livewires,people that get upset over little things,and she has also encouraged women to consider their own personal values and what’s important to them and whether certain men are in line with those values.If not she advises the women against getting in those relationships period…But yes, while she does speak against women getting in relationships with damaged and crazed men at the same time she seems to think it is our responsibility to save/change them.How?I don’t know.I’m not doing that anyway.(shoulder shrug)

          • Oh, so there is some useful information mixed in with the poison of telling women that they’re somehow responsible for saving/changing men. {less appalled, but still shaking my head}

  10. To The Reader Whose Comments I Have Rejected,

    Your grudge/gripe/issue with your “foreign BW coworker” is not relevant to this post. I don’t know why you keep trying to interject this grudge into the conversation, but it’s off-topic and won’t be published.

    Expect Success!

  11. laylah says:

    You guys really worship white culture.

    “White people feed all of us. Directly or indirectly. We need to stop “tripping” about that.”

    You’re literally telling black people NOT to do anything about the current situation. What we NEED to do is work on waking our brothers and sisters up. Black nationalism is possible…we just need more people, literally. We have these black women out here who worship white culture via getting weaves, perms, and colored contacts, and then wonder why their sons grow up liking white women. Why should these black men have knock off white women?

    “Nobody except African-American women is sacrificing anything in order to “fight” White hegemony.”

    NOBODY? WORD? Where the hell are you located? Shiet I know people who are ACTIVELY planning to upgrade our culture. My bf is in medical school, went to an HBCU and his dream in life is to own & work land AND build a black school. He’s planning to open this school with other black males. I know of PLENTY of other black males who are ALL down for black nationalism. You’re obviously hanging out in the wrong circles.

    and then you went into a spiel about how we dont get the same rockstar status when we fight for the same cause. That’s true, can’t argue there…
    But are you doing this to attention whore and get d*ck? I mean…what woman WANTS to sleep around like that?

    My man protects me better than any cracker ever could. If you can’t find a black male to protect you then there is definitely something wrong with you and I can tell by this post that there IS, indeed something wrong.

  12. Khadija,

    Why did you decide to not join the NOI?

  13. LorMarie says:

    Yup, we can bash white feminists up and down…even I don’t connect with them on many issues. But even I can admit that we’ve got a whole lot to thank them for.

    • lafemmenoir says:

      Cosign, cosign, cosign!!!

      I am so happy that they set the standards and not women of color. Like Khadija and other sensible women, I shudder to think of what our lives would be like if we looked to our oppressors for protection. When I say oppressors, I mean BLACK men.

      We would be another South Africa.

  14. Laylah,

    Learn to speak without having to use profanity. I don’t like editing comments, but I don’t publish profane speech here.

    You said, “You guys really worship white culture.”

    {chuckling} It’s more a matter of speaking the truth about the benefits you and I enjoy as Black women living in the industrialized West. If you’re unhappy with enjoying these benefits, you’re quite free to relocate to any Black-led paradise of your choosing on this planet. You know, like Haiti, the Congo, or any other Black country on this planet. Please go. Quickly.

    By the way, I noticed that you couldn’t dispute the fact that “White hegemony” is currently feeding all AAs. Directly or indirectly. The AA collective has consistently refused to get serious about building the infrastructure needed to be self-sufficient. And we abandoned the businesses we had at the end of segregation (with the exception of barbershops and hair salons). Those are plain facts. You might not like these facts, or what they say about the AA collective. But they are what they are. Engaging in wishful thinking won’t change the facts.

    You said, “You’re literally telling black people NOT to do anything about the current situation.”

    I’m stating the obvious out loud: The established pattern for the past 4 DECADES is that AAs have not, are not, and will not do anything to change this situation. I’m telling African-American women to wake up and smell the coffee about that fact. And to STOP serving as cannon fodder, and stop fighting ALONE while the masses of AA males live their individual lives and seek their individual bliss.

    You said, “What we NEED to do is work on waking our brothers and sisters up. Black nationalism is possible…we just need more people, literally.”

    Oh, puh-leeze. If after a combined 80 years of preaching plus concrete actions and achievements, Elijah Muhammad and Min. Farrakhan couldn’t “wake up” our so-called brothers and sisters—

    —you must be hallucinating if you think anything you…or your boyfriend…or your friends… have to say will make any difference. You flatter yourself without cause.

    You, your boyfriend, your friends, and whoever else you want to invoke won’t succeed where Elijah Muhammad failed. Elijah Muhammad’s son, Min. Ishmael Muhammad, is married to a NON-Black woman. What you’re talking about is a fool’s errand at this point.

    You said, “We have these black women out here who worship white culture via getting weaves, perms, and colored contacts, and then wonder why their sons grow up liking white women.”

    You say this as if you don’t know that BW wear these styles to appease Black males. As if you don’t know that BM have had a centuries-long fetish for light, bright, and White women. BM’s fetish for women with non-Black features and hair pre-dates the existence of perms, weaves, colored contact lenses, etc. You’re being dishonest.

    You said, “NOBODY? WORD? Where the hell are you located? Shiet I know people who are ACTIVELY planning to upgrade our culture. My bf is in medical school, went to an HBCU and his dream in life is to own & work land AND build a black school. He’s planning to open this school with other black males. I know of PLENTY of other black males who are ALL down for black nationalism. You’re obviously hanging out in the wrong circles.”

    {laughter} Tell that nonsense to the women in the Deborah Movement! In fact, why don’t you, your boyfriend, your friends and the other so-called legions of conscious, active AA men that you claim to personally know come to Chicago and relieve the Deborah Movement women from having to patrol the streets in their Black neighborhoods by themselves. They could sure use some help from the “PLENTY of other black males who are ALL down for black nationalism” that you know.

    Since the the Deborah movement women obviously don’t hang out in the “right circles,” they could use the help of all these conscious, down with Black Nationalism BM you know. These women have been praying and waiting for Black men like the ones that you claim to know. They’re waiting for you AND your legions of conscious, active, down with Black Nationalism BM—they’re waiting for all of y’all! Hurry!

    Let me guess…You, your boyfriend, your friends, and the “PLENTY of other black males who are ALL down for black nationalism” AREN’T coming to Chicago to relieve the Deborah movement women? Hmmm, I guess these Deborah movement women are living in the “wrong circles”…

    In fact, judging by the conditions that prevail in these places, then 99.99% of the AA residential areas in the US are “the wrong places” that are filled with “wrong circles”! If you, your boyfriend, your friends, and whoever else you want to invoke were in any way representative of AAs, then Black residential areas would not be in the condition they’re in.

    You said, “and then you went into a spiel about how we dont get the same rockstar status when we fight for the same cause. That’s true, can’t argue there…
    But are you doing this to attention whore and get d*ck? I mean…what woman WANTS to sleep around like that?”

    It’s amusing to see how you put down the “rockstar” benefits that BM activists so eagerly claim. It’s only called “attention whoring” and chasing after flesh when BW raise the issue of not getting these same perks from activism as BM. As if the only benefit of rockstar status is sleeping around. It seems to me that there are plenty of other material and emotional benefits—like the ones covered by the hierarchy of needs pyramid. Furthermore, let’s not summarily discount the positive emotional feedback that people often get through sex, and through being idolized by large numbers of people.

    You said, “My man protects me better than any cracker ever could. If you can’t find a black male to protect you then there is definitely something wrong with you and I can tell by this post that there IS, indeed something wrong.”

    Again, you need to tell that to the Deborah movement women. Or the BW who are living in fear in hellholes like Dunbar Village. Or the BW who are living in fear in Black residential areas throughout the US. I don’t suggest you repeat that nonsense to the countless BW and girls who have already been beaten, robbed, carjacked, or raped in Black residential areas. You can’t tell that mess to the BW and girls who have been already been murdered in Black residential neighborhoods. They’re dead.

    May you find your way to reality. Before your denial and fantasies cost you your life, or the life of a loved one. Ameen. [“Amen.”]
    ________________________________________________

    RevoluntionaryAndJoyful,

    You said, “Why did you decide to not join the NOI?”

    Mostly because I don’t believe in joining groups that I know I’ll ultimately get put out of. :-)

    First, I knew there was NO way that I could ever fix my lips to say their blasphemous dogma about believing that “God came in the person of Master Fard Muhammad, etc.” [One of the biggest sins in (orthodox) Islam is to associate partners with God.] Second, they demand waaay too much of their members’ time. I had to study a lot more than before when I was in law school, AND I wanted to continue having a social life.
    _____________________________________________

    LorMarie,

    You said, “Yup, we can bash white feminists up and down…even I don’t connect with them on many issues. But even I can admit that we’ve got a whole lot to thank them for.”

    That’s what I’m saying. A simple acknowledgment of the truth. It’s similar to how every HIV+ Black person on the planet who is still alive because of an affordable cocktail of HIV/AIDs medications owes a debt of gratitude to the WM gay activists of the 1980s group ACT-UP. I don’t like the way modern White gay activists want to hijack the legacy of the AA civil rights movement for their purposes. In fact, I find this extremely offensive. Nevertheless, I speak the truth about the ways that their predecessors like Larry Kramer and ACT-UP did things that ultimately saved countless HIV+ Black folks’ lives. [Not that this was their intention, but it was the side effect of their activism.]

    Expect Success!

  15. mochachoc says:

    Khadija it’s interesting that you get accused of worshiping white culture when you speak of black woman protection. Laylah I don’t know about where you live but I know there is NO black cavalry on its way in my town. The white dominated police is the last line of defense for Black women and children. When we refuse to call them we are inadvertently giving the criminals around us carte blanche to do as they please. We must not believe the lie that involving the police is a betrayal. This is what black male criminals want you to believe.

    I like not living in the Congo. I am grateful for our police.

  16. Mochachoc,

    You said, “Khadija it’s interesting that you get accused of worshiping white culture when you speak of black woman protection.”

    Yes, and it’s interesting how telling the simple truth about BW having NO organized protectors or providers brings some particularly nasty scum out of the woodwork (which I’ll get to after responding to your comment).

    It’s also extremely interesting to see how far down the list of priorities BW’s and Black girls’ safety is. Actually, BW’s and Black girls’ safety isn’t even on these people’s list of priorities. That includes hallucinating BW like Layla. {shaking my head}

    You said, “Laylah I don’t know about where you live but I know there is NO black cavalry on its way in my town.”

    The harsh reality is that there’s NO Black cavalry riding to the rescue wherever Layla is living. Because there’s NO Black cavalry (despite her hallucinations). That’s why, for just one example, increasing numbers school-age AA children are murdered each year in Chicago’s Black residential neighborhoods. With the new technology, folks can now watch their murders after they occur, like the video of Derrion Albert.

    You said, “The white dominated police is the last line of defense for Black women and children.”

    Why is this common-sense observation so difficult for some BW (like Layla) to understand—so confusing to them that they twist it around into a “worship” of White culture? That’s crazy. Especially considering that Layla’s confused behind is ALSO in danger whenever she roams AA residential areas! Whether she’s with or without her conscious BM boyfriend. Negro male criminals won’t hesitate to kill him, either! And if her boyfriend is a normal guy, then I doubt that he’s armed and prepared like Rambo to have the capacity to shoot back. She and other BW like her need to stop tripping. Before their luck runs out.
    ________________________________________________________

    **My One-Time-Only Response to “Points” Raised By a Particularly Foul, BW-Hating Troll**

    I can always tell when I’ve hit a nerve when particularly foul creatures feel compelled to try to disrupt the conversation here. This was discussed at length during the post Another Look at Legitimate Dissent Versus Sabotage.

    Well, the same foul, Taliban-admiring “Visitor” that I mentioned in the post 28 Signs of a Domestically Violent African-American Male tried to leave a comment. As I mentioned in that post,

    Many Black Women Treat Probable Black Male Predators Like Normal People
    When watching online interactions, I’m often mystified by watching women repeatedly try to dialogue with Internet Ike Turners™ (a descriptive and handy phrase coined by Gina, blog host of What About Our Daughters) as if they are normal men. I often have to remind myself that other women haven’t had the mass exposure to abusive men that I’ve had while defending them in the court system. Women aren’t catching the warning signals these men are giving off because they don’t recognize them. I worry that women are most likely carrying over this same behavior into their offline lives.

    . . . A Quick Checklist of Some Statements and Attitudes Prevalent Among Domestically Violent African-American Males
    So, here’s a quick checklist of the typical statements and attitudes expressed by domestically violent African-American males. This checklist is not meant to be exhaustive, but it represents the “highlights” of the mindset that I’ve heard expressed by most of the domestically violent African-American men that I’ve represented. Some of these statements and attitudes are common among domestically violent men among all races and ethnic groups. Some of them are culturally specific to domestically violent African-American males. [For one example, non-African-American men don’t whine about what men outside their ethnic group won’t "let" them do.]

    . . . (2) He speaks favorably—without any real points of repudiation—about groups and cultures that are brutally oppressive to women such as the Taliban, Saudi Arabia, and what he claims are “traditional” African cultures. This is a very bad signal.

    [For an example of this, at least in reference to the Taliban, see the comments of an individual calling himself “Visitor” during this recent conversation at What About Our Daughters. *Note: I’m not in any way saying that “Visitor” is a woman-beater. I have no idea what “Visitor” does or does not do in his life. However, several of his statements are useful examples of the warning-signal statements and attitudes on this checklist.

    What I found fascinating was that so many women kept talking to this “Visitor” individual as if he was a legitimate conversation participant. Even after his opening comment consisted of deliberately mischaracterizing the message and mission of that particular blog. Multiple women readers kept interacting with this “Visitor” individual. Instead of letting the blog host and another man (Blk SeaGoat) who participated in the conversation deal with him.

    I’ve repeated all of the above, so that new audience members can understand why this “Visitor” creature won’t be allowed to have the microphone here. This blog does NOT have open-microphone nights for individuals who support violence against Black women. Whether such individuals are Internet Ike Turners or Ikettes. Later on, a reader sent me a link to a crazy conversation where supposedly this “Visitor” creature revealed itself to be a heavily-male-identified Black woman. It doesn’t matter. Whichever gender this creature is, it supports violence against BW. So it doesn’t get a voice here.

    But, just this once, I will quickly dispense with the extemely weak “points” it tried to raise.

    (1) The “Visitor” troll argues that fatherless, husband-less neighborhoods are the most violent ones. Okay, so far, so good—this is what I and other BWE bloggers have been saying all along! In the post Who Else Wants An Optimal Lifestyle?, I said (emphasis added),

    The final trait of the “Black women as martyrs” recruiters is that they are content with the current situation of large numbers of African-American women and children suffering. This is what underlies the rest of their behavior. This is why the only thing that captures their attention, and rouses them into anxiety is the possibility that more Black women will follow Black men’s lead and seek their own bliss.

    Despite their insincere “Black love” rhetoric, they don’t have a problem with the mass absence of marriage among African-Americans. They are not concerned about most African-American children being born out of wedlock. The legions of African-American children who are fatherless don’t bother them.

    They are also not concerned about the collective consequences of the above circumstances. Consequences like the increasing numbers of atrocities committed by roving packs of fatherless Black male adolescents. One example was the crime against humanity known as the Dunbar Village gang rape case. The assailants in this case (a pack of fatherless Black male teenagers) raped a mother and forced her at gunpoint to perform oral sex on her own son.

    I hate to mention these appalling details, but you need to be clear about what the martyrdom recruiters are demanding of you. First, they want you and other Black women to continue living among such predators within increasingly dangerous Black residential areas. Second, they want you and other Black women to take the lead in somehow dealing with the growing legions of these types of fatherless, Black male predators.

    And they intend for those misguided Black women who take on martyrdom missions to continue to do so alone. It’s significant that these recruiters have not formed their own version of the Guardian Angels, or lifted a finger to lessen any of the threats to your life that exist within Black residential areas. All they do is talk about why you should not seek an optimal life. They are content with the collective situation as it is. This is the reality underlying their lack of action.

    The “Visitor” creature wants to pretend—dishonestly—that it hasn’t already read BWE bloggers talking about the connection between fatherlessness, oow, and the violence in AA residential areas. I know that the “Visitor” creature has read the many references that this blog has made to this connection—readers have sent me comments showing that this “Visitor” creature avidly reads this blog! It reminds me of how Black conservatives try to appropriate Black Nationalist talking points for themselves, but they omit half of the talking point.

    (2) This technique of trying to appropriate a BWE talking point and following it up with a distortion is what the “Visitor” creature did when it followed up the above observation by claiming that AA women are choosing to use government as a “beta provider” instead of husbands. The “Visitor” creature says this as if AA women are the ones withholding marriage from AA males. As if AA males are making marriage proposals left and right only to have these proposals rejected by BW. No, what’s happening is that AA males are withholding marriage and the nuclear family from AA women and the out of wedlock children that these males sire.

    Again, AA males’ mass refusal to marry the BW they impregnate was mentioned in the Who Else Wants An Optimal Lifestyle? post,

    FOR EXAMPLE, STOP TRYING TO SAVE “BLACK MARRIAGE” IN AMERICA—IT WON’T BE RESURRECTED BECAUSE 50% OF THE NEEDED PARTICIPANTS—BLACK MEN—PREFER THAT IT REMAINS DEAD
    There won’t be any collective solution to what has been called “Black Marital Mogadishu” in the United States because 50% of the participants needed for any Black marriage—Black men—benefit from the current absence of marriage among African-Americans. Black men generally like things the way they are right now.

    The collapse of the African-American family is not about a lack of jobs. It’s about African-American men generally being content with the collapse of the African-American family. Black men will complain about the aftershocks created by the mass absence of marriage among African-Americans, such as the legions of fatherless, violent Black male criminals. But other than that, they’re content with the status quo.

    Anybody who thinks that this behavior is driven by a lack of opportunity should examine the collective behavior of the African-American men who do have “good” educations and jobs. Since so many Black men in that category are not marrying at all, or they’re not marrying Black women, there’s no reason to assume that Black women would gain from African-American men having more opportunities. I learned that just by watching the behavior of the Black men that went to college and law school with me. There’s usually little to no return on that investment (creating opportunities for African-American men) flowing back to any Black woman at all.

    If you look at their mass behavior and not their rhetoric, it’s clear that most African-American men don’t value marriage, and are not concerned about the now-dead “Black family.” African-American men like the status quo situation of their mass refusal to marry the Black women they have sex with and impregnate. From outward appearances, most African-American men are happy with a lifetime of sleeping around without the commitments or responsibilities of marriage.

    If you look at their mass behavior, it’s also clear that African-American men are also not particularly concerned about the children they produce.

    These “save the dead Black family” discussions are not even a blip on most African-American men’s radar . . . unless Black women start talking about solutions that don’t include continuing to wait around for African-American men—such as interracial marriage and a focus on dating non-African-American Black men (for those Black women who must have a Black man as their husband).

    This is the point that many Black men (and the Black “race women” who are so Black-male identified that they can’t see straight) enter these conversations. They do so solely to try to defend Black men’s image and the status quo, not out of any genuine concern about the already-dead Black family. This is when you hear various bad-faith assertions, such as:

    Denials that the Black family and Black marriage are dead in the United States.

    Attempts to minimize African-American men’s culpability for their own mass actions. (Their mass failure to protect or provide for African-American children, including the failure to provide stable, married households for their children to grow up within.)

    Attempts to scare Black women away from exploring their interracial marriage options. (The “White men will just use you for sex and never marry you” rhetoric. Meanwhile, that’s exactly what the masses of African-American men are using Black women for, and not marrying them. Somehow, this detail escapes the Black male protectionists’ notice.)

    Nonstop pressure for Black women to lower whatever standards they might have. They apply this pressure through incessant demands to hear Black women say, over and again, that they would date blue collar Black men.

    Meanwhile, no other type of woman on this planet is required to recite a “dating loyalty oath” to include blue collar men as dating partners. Many of the same African-American men who insist that Black women swear dating allegiance to blue collar Black men also demand that Black women extend this same dating allegiance to Black male ex-convicts, Black male recovering addicts, old Black men for young Black women (see Steve Harvey), and so on.

    Attempts to pretend that others are doing the same things and having the same experiences to the same degree. No, nobody else is having out of wedlock children at the rate of African-Americans. No, nobody else is trying to turn a woman having an education into a stigma at the rate of African-Americans. Others might be experiencing milder versions of these pathologies, but nobody is living like the masses of African-Americans.

    (3) Finally, the “Visitor” creature ignored the same physical danger that she lived in to claim that “Coretta had it easy.” {sarcasm on} Yes, I suppose it was “easy” for her to live under death threats while spending all that time unprotected and ALONE with their small children. Sure, right. {sarcasm off}

    This “Visitor” creature also conveniently ignores the beatings (and unpublicized rapes) of unsung, uncelebrated AA women civil rights activists. Since AAs never valued these women, we’ve never really tallied up what these AA women activists suffered, including the rapes and murders. Since the White segregationists went so far as to murder a Northern WW like Viola Liuzzo, why would anybody believe they held back their hands when it came to killing BW. These White segregationists had already racked up a long history and body count of lynching BW by the time the civil rights movement started. But AAs never bothered to count any atrocities that were committed against BW, such as:

    partial list

    Printed as a community service by Dr. Daniel Meaders, Professor
    of History at William Patterson University, and author of several
    books and articles, including Dead or Alive, Fugitive Slaves and
    White Indentured Servants Before 1800 (Garland Press, 1993)

    Jennie Steers
    In 1903. a mob lynched Jennie Steers of Louisiana for
    supposedly giving a white teenager a glass of poisoned
    lemonade. Before they killed her, the mob tried to force her to
    confess but she refused. (100 Years at Lynching. Ralph
    Ginzburg)

    Laura Nelson
    Laura Nelson was lynched on May 23, 1911 In Okemah,
    Okluskee, Oklahoma. Her fifteen year old son was also lynched
    at the same lime but I could not find a photo of her son. The
    photograph of Nelson was drawn from a postcard. Authorities
    accused her of killing a deputy sheriff who supposedly stumbled
    on some stolen goods in her house. Why they lynched her child
    is a mystery. The mob raped and dragged Nelson six miles to
    the Canadian River and hanged her from a bridge.(NAACP: One
    Hundred Years of Lynching in the US 1889 1918 )

    Ann Barksdale or Ann Bostwick
    The lynchers maintained that Ann Barksdale or Ann Bostwlck
    killed her female employer in Georgia In 1912. Nobody knows if
    or why Barksdale or Bostick killed her employer because there
    was no trial and no one thought to take a statement from this
    Black woman who authorities claimed had”violent fits of
    insanity” and should have been placed in a hospital Nobody was
    arrested and the crowd was In a festive mood. Placed in a car
    with a rope around her neck, and the other end tied to a tree
    limb, the lynchers drove at high speed and she was strangled to
    death. For good measure the mob shot her eyes out and shot
    enough bullets Into her body that she was “cut in two.”

    Marie Scott
    In 1914, a white mob yanked seventeen year-old Maria Scott
    from jail and hanged her from a telephone pole in Wagoner
    county, Oklahoma. What happened? Two white men barged Into
    her house and one “assaulted” her. Her brother apparently killed
    the assailant and fled. Frustrated by their inability to lynch Maria Scott’s brother the mob lynched Maria Scott. (Crisis. 1914)

    Mary Turner 1918 Eight Months Pregnant
    Mobs lynched Mary Turner on May 17, 1918 in Lowndes County.
    Georgia because she tried to stop them from killing her
    husband, accused of shooting and killing Hampton Smith, a
    white farmer, and wounding his wife. Sidney Johnson. a Black,
    apparently killed Smith because he was tired of the farmer’s
    abuse. Unable to find Johnson. the killers lynched eight other
    Blacks Including Hayes Turner and his wife Mary. The mob
    hanged Mary by her feet, poured gasoline and oil on her and set
    fire to her body. One white man sliced her open and Mrs.
    Turner’s baby tumbled to the ground with a “little cry” and the
    mob stomped the baby to death and sprayed bullets into Mary
    Turner. (NAACP: Thirty Years of Lynching in the U.S. 1889-1918

    {sarcasm on}I guess these AA women “had it easy” too . . . just like Coretta King, and other BW civil rights activists. {sarcasm off}

    This is from here.

    Expect Success!

  17. Felicia says:

    Thank you for setting these self-hating creatures straight and giving them a little history lesson Khadija.

    They are choosing to be blind, deaf, and dumb.

    And they – along with their children – are going to be the victims of their denial. Stupid delusional low and no self-esteemed coddling black female mules are being cannibalized daily by the damaged beyond repair black male monsters who are often of their OWN creation. I say GOOD RIDDANCE to these fools. The ONLY ones I feel sorry for – up to a certain point – are their innocent children. BEFORE they’ve been ruined too.

    And of course I feel extreme sorrow for the TRULY decent innocent BW and black children (and those few BM who are actively trying to make a positive difference) who are getting caught in the crossfire of these DBRBM animals.

    It’s not “white culture” that anyone is “praising”/supporting, it’s basic normal human VALUES related to family, safety, child rearing, etc… that are the SAME the world over in western countries and tend to predominate in NON black run societies/communities/countries.

    These ABC (acting black crew) creatures are the ONLY ones (along with the Stormfront types) associating basic normality, humane human values, and normal civilized and respectful relations between genders, etc… with whiteness and white culture.

    THIS tells me everything I need to know about the way THEY feel about blackness and black culture. What THEY feel blackness and black people “should” represent. The OPPOSITE of normality.

    These creatures are truly SICK.

    And that’s why I encourage EVERY BW in the listening audience to FLEE from these ABC creatures. They and their self-hating mindsets are POISONOUS.

    They’ve already basically destroyed the African-American image in the popular culture world wide with these insane “normality = white” self-hating notions of theirs.

    They’d LOVE to take as many individual BW down the tubes with them as possible. ESPECIALLY since the word is spreading that NORMAL marriages/relations/interactions between the sexes are STILL possible OUTSIDE of all black Hell holes in the GLOBAL village.

    And a growing number of BW are taking advantage of these positive benefits of socializing and marrying OUT to normal non color-struck WM and other non damaged non DBRBM.

    All of these truths are FINALLY seeing the light of day and that’s why these creatures are crawling out from under their rocks.

    Again, thanks and a HIGH FIVE for handling them righteously Khadija.

  18. magenta says:

    I wonder what Laylah and Visitor have to say about the 90 year old black woman who was beaten and gang raped in Detroit. I hate posting “DBR horror stopries” but it is very relevant to the discussion. http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2010/08/family_members_say_two_elderly.html

    Looks like the Congo has already come to various black “communities” across the country. I think many of us are still in denial about how dangerous these neighborhoods are for women and girls. I think about the town in Mexico where HUNDREDS of women and girls have been murdered and nobody has batten an eyelash. Complete apathy to the plight of women and girls plus no competent law enforcement has turned Ciudad Juárez into a breeding ground for DOZENS of rapist and serial killers.

    White feminism and the white legal system are the only things that prevent Congo and Ciudad Juárez-style horror shows from taking place in the U.S.

  19. magenta says:

    Thanks Khadija for posting the information about the black women who were the victims of lynching. You would think that ONLY black men were the victims of hate crime during slavery and the civil rights movement. I am sure this revisionist history is intentional. I would love to see more African American studies programs give more time to the contributions of BW but I won’t hold my breath.

  20. Felicia,

    You’re welcome! In real life, most Colored folks who want to pose as “conscious,” Black Nationalist types know better than to try to play “Blacker than thou” with me. :-)

    And my first question to the very few fools who try to “go there” with me is usually to ask, “Why do you still carry your former slave master’s name?” Most of these folks continue to wear their European former slave masters’ names. If they ever use a non-Western name, then they only use it online or as a “pen name.” When it counts—such as when applying for grad school or a job—these ultra Black-Black folks continue to use their former slave masters’ names.

    The next step in real life is to compare—chapter and verse—MY personal history of activism and service to Black folks with the NOTHING that most of these armchair Black Nationalists have been doing. Typically, there’s NOTHING in these people’s educational, employment, spare time, or personal life choices that reflects any real sacrifice for, or investment in, Black folks. The only support they give is rhetorical—lip service. Lip service and offering up BW as human sacrifices.

    These clowns have NOTHING to show for their empty rhetoric. And they have the unmitigated gall to believe that they’re going to succeed where Elijah Muhammad and Min. Farrakhan failed?!! They must be insane.

    You said, “It’s not “white culture” that anyone is “praising”/supporting, it’s basic normal human VALUES related to family, safety, child rearing, etc… that are the SAME the world over in western countries and tend to predominate in NON black run societies/communities/countries.

    These ABC (acting black crew) creatures are the ONLY ones (along with the Stormfront types) associating basic normality, humane human values, and normal civilized and respectful relations between genders, etc… with whiteness and white culture.

    THIS tells me everything I need to know about the way THEY feel about blackness and black culture. What THEY feel blackness and black people “should” represent. The OPPOSITE of normality.”

    Indeed. So, if a BW wants to live in physical safety (and wants her children to also live in safety), then she “worships” White culture. Like you said, that tells us all we need to know about the individuals who make those statements.
    _________________________________________________

    Magenta,

    You’re welcome! It’s appalling that AAs have never made any effort to remember the AA women who were lynched. The only victims of racist violence that we’ve collectively chosen to remember are BM…

    You said, “I wonder what Laylah and Visitor have to say about the 90 year old black woman who was beaten and gang raped in Detroit. I hate posting “DBR horror stopries” but it is very relevant to the discussion.”

    I suppose Laylah would say that these elderly victims are in the “wrong circles” and have failed to make the acquaintance of “the right brothers.”

    I don’t like posting those types of DBR horror stories either, but like you said, it’s totally relevant to this conversation. As you noted, “…the Congo has already come to various black “communities” across the country.”

    Yes, the Congo has already arrived in certain AA residential areas, and is coming soon to a neighborhood near most AA women. This is why more AA women better recognize who it is that’s offering them (and their children) any level whatsoever of organized protection—WM-dominated law enforcement.

    You said, “White feminism and the white legal system are the only things that prevent Congo and Ciudad Juárez-style horror shows from taking place in the U.S.”

    That’s the stone-cold truth.

    Expect Success!

  21. Hodan says:

    Very controversial discussion and one some within the racist right wingers would use to further dehumanize and demonize us.I agree with you thou that without a rule of law there can be no safety or security for any functioning civilized nation.

    However, I do not consider someone skin color to be the determining factor of their propensity towards violence….rather like the Taliban and certain mind set within the Muslim society….black community have been stagnated and practice a backward form of inhumane cultural norms where men have abdicated their sense of honor and responsibility. I also thing black women are the biggest enabler of black men and their violence. It never cease to disgust me how black women with vulnerable children bring thugs and ex-cons into their life and then wonder why their life went to hell.

    Furthermore, I do not trust men, they are natural predator….hence why anytime civil unrest breaks up whether its in white society from Russia to former Yugoslavia to black countries like Congo or Uganda, women and children are the first ones to be targeted for unspeakable crimes against humanity. In the white community, sexual violence and domestic abuse happens….in fact 1 in 4 white woman is raped by a man in her lifetime. The difference between White and Black community, these abuses are not condoned or considered less of a crime. What is sad about the black community is how they tolerate criminal predatory men…..hence the disgusting cultural norm you are talking about.

    3. White dominated law firms are the fabric of American culture and its what constitutes any modern Western country. Its a reality check many have come to recognize…and that is the importance of upholding human rights and the rule of law to maintain peace and a functioning society. Similarly, why even some in dictatorship would live under tyranny to preserve peace and prevent violence against children and women (think China).

  22. Icon says:

    Thank you for the quote Khadija and for this important (in fact LIFE PRESERVING) piece.

    Even during Hurricane Katrina what happened? Rape, and lots of it. To the point victims were turned away (because of the extreme amount) for more “life-threatening” illnesses. It wasn’t until cops and soldiers started being airlifted in to control them that it severely decreased. So it’s not just foreign blacks. We have a preview of life to come under lawlessness in black neighborhoods in the prime of crack and lawlessness for a period in the ’80s and during times of decreased police presence (such as Katrina) right now. And we already know of the heightened amount of safety during gentrification either because 1. Black criminals who often felt completely comfortable raping and pillaging; committing “drive by’s”, etc., around black women and children, didn’t feel “comfortable” doing such around whites. 2. They were driven out by police who frequently patrol black neighborhoods. 3. Whites call the cops for everything from increased litter to noise disturbances, black people don’t, and have things like neighborhood watch. 4. All of the above. The reason why girls can be raped and groped in black neighborhoods now (in daylight or not) is because of the STUPID “no snitching” rule that ensures that when people see something dangerous, they DO NOT call the cops. And criminal blacks keep winning.

    I’m not saying cops are not racist (usually this does involve frisking, harassing and searching black MEN not black women, but still, some cops are racist against black people collectively). So I already know some cops are racist. But so are higher education institutes, the workforce, etc., Should we forgo education and looking for work because of racism? So why is it that we believe we can “afford” to be anti-cop when our very immediate survival is threatened by danger just by being in close proximity to ANY area throughout the world where black men are the majority?

    “The next step in real life is to compare—chapter and verse—MY personal history of activism and service to Black folks with the NOTHING that most of these armchair Black Nationalists have been doing.”

    LOL, true. And it’s interesting, Hurricane Katrina happened when I was an undergrad, all the pan-african super-seniors (usually ages 26-30 and male) preaching about the horror of it all did not go to New Orleans to volunteer. NOT ONE. And our school was offering academic credit for going. It was all liberal white college students that volunteered. I remember I made the conscious effort not to go because of my feminism and hearing the number of women getting raped there, and I immediately felt guilty. Part of me wishes I could go back to my guilt-ridden self and propose the question of why “good black men” and pan african men who would be safer going chose not to go without a second thought, while I felt guilty.

    Anyway, it would be considered anti-BM to mention the lack of safety in black countries and communities. I noticed that the nationalists, pan africans, etc., I knew may “travel” but it’s usually NOT to areas where black people are the majority. It’s places like Egypt (I was there working on my senior thesis as a major in the arts, and most of the BM who went wanted to get a taste of “Afrikuh” through arab countries without traveling to black Africa, because of danger). And that’s EVEN IF they decide to go to Africa at all. I did and do encounter a few BM who have been to Brazil (despite its lack of safety, but more than likely to be around mixed women) and other places. No one brings up the so called “self sufficent” rhetoric in relation to the few IF ANY black male nationalists who’ve made the conscious decision to learn to hunt, plant a garden, and are not trying to learn. They/we are EXTREMELY dependent on white/ immigrant stores, doctors, medical supplies and so forth. I know for a fact life is not peaches and cream here in America, or other predominately white countries. But we’re trivializing the experiences of black women throughout the world who have the lowest possible quality of life if they are dependent on resources, safety, etc., from black men and not white men.

    I don’t mean to harp on black men, but it is clear that the only people consistently putting themselves in harms way and stressing about being a hypocrite to the movement ARE black women. With cops, and with everything else.

  23. Hodan,

    Let me try to express this as gently and diplomatically as possible:

    I know it upsets you (as an African) to hear specific (and perhaps any) African countries spoken of in an unflattering light. However, the truth is the truth. I would respectfully suggest that you focus any displeasure and concern you feel on the African men who are committing atrocities—and the African women who enable them—instead of focusing this reaction on the people who refuse to tell lies to cover up for these particular Africans.

    Speaking for myself, I REFUSE to cooperate in any way with large numbers of my AA sisters ending up like the women in the Congo, South Africa, Rwanda, or Haiti. And that includes my refusal to tell lies (by omission) about the misery that women live under in these countries.

    I’m sorry if it hurts African (and Haitian) women’s feelings to hear me and other Western BW say that we DON’T want to end up living in hellish conditions like so many African women (or the Haitian women in displaced persons camps); but it doesn’t change anything. It’s similar to how I don’t take offense when I hear Africans say that they don’t want their children (particularly those who are raised in the West) to end up like AAs. Either way, the truth is the truth. I don’t expect Africans to sabotage their own interests to spare hurting AAs’ feelings. I expect the same courtesy to be extended to my wish to protect my AA sisters from lives of mass rape.

    You said, “Very controversial discussion and one some within the racist right wingers would use to further dehumanize and demonize us.”

    No, no, no…I say “NO” to the “dirty laundry argument.” I’m committed to telling the truth. I’m not going to start lying due to worry about what some right-wing racist might do with the truth. Especially when lying about the truth (or trying to minimize it) would serve to further endanger AA women’s lives. In any event, efforts to hide the dirty laundry rarely succeed. Other people (in this case, non-Blacks) see our dirty laundry floating down the street like tumbleweeds whether we speak the truth about it or not.

    You said, “However, I do not consider someone skin color to be the determining factor of their propensity towards violence…”

    Nobody said that skin color is the (or even a) determining factor of people’s propensity toward violence. Respectfully, you’re hearing things that were never said. Wounded pride can often cause that sort of reaction.

    You said, “Furthermore, I do not trust men, they are natural predator….hence why anytime civil unrest breaks up whether its in white society from Russia to former Yugoslavia to black countries like Congo or Uganda, women and children are the first ones to be targeted for unspeakable crimes against humanity.”

    Well, I don’t have those sorts of blanket beliefs about men. Many men are natural predators. On the other hand, there are many men who are naturally protective of women and children. I will say this: Russia (aka the former Soviet Union) and Yugoslavia are/were multi-ethnic states. In terms of atrocities committed in these countries during civil unrest, predatory men were typically preying on women and children from OTHER ethnic groups—and usually NOT women and children from their OWN ethnic group.

    The difference in much of the Black world (particularly AA gangrapists and the Haitian gangrapists) is that BM are attacking women and children from their OWN ethnic group(s). That’s a difference and distinction that can’t be wished away.

    No matter how much you might want to save face by believing that the levels and types of wrongs being committed are equal in the White West and the Black world, they’re NOT. This inequality isn’t about race or color. It’s about the Black world’s failure to establish the rule of law in most Black countries. In the case of AAs, it’s about our mass cultural shift away from the rule of law.

    The Rwanda genocide was between different ethnic groups. I’m not quite sure if Rwandan men were gangraping women from their own ethnic groups. In terms of the Congo situation, I don’t know if Congolese men are gangraping women and children from their own ethnic group. It sounds like Congolese men are busy gangraping any and every girl and woman that crosses their path—including girls and women from their own ethnnic group(s). But I haven’t taken the time to look that deeply into whatever nuances of the mass rape that’s going on there.

    This has echoes of an earlier “agree to disagree” conversation that we had about Western economies, Asian economies, and the failed economies of the countries in the Black world.** You keep trying to make a (I believe false) equivalence between temporary breakdowns of the rule of law in previously functioning and successful White countries and the enduring, permanent failure to establish any rule of law in so many Black countries. There is NO comparison.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    **Since, as Hodan stated, this is a controversial conversation, I know that some folks are working overtime to “get it twisted.” Meanwhile, there are nuances to what people are saying here. So there’s no confusion about the nuances of what I’m saying, let me repeat the exchange that I had with Hodan during the earlier conversation that I referenced above:

    Hodan,

    You said, “I must be missing something, but are you saying that being black exempts one from critiquing any of these countries because in comparison an African country wouldn’t be equal to it? Its like saying a Chinese person cannot critique or examine political and social structure of Japan or South Korea, because the former lacks any legitimate democracy, while the later has a strong civil government.”

    South Korea is exporting Hyundai cars and Samsung electronic gadgets to Americans. Japan has been exporting various finished products to the US for quite some time. What does the Black world export except for raw materials? Regardless of its degree of tyranny, the Chinese government has been successfully feeding numbers approaching a BILLION people. Meanwhile, there are places in the Black world where successive governments still can’t or won’t feed their own people.

    I’ve read a number of Islamic scholars mention that “knowledge is adorned by actions.” And that knowledge isn’t simply what has been memorized, actual knowledge is that which is benefited from. There’s also a samurai proverb that makes a similar point. ["To know and to act are one and the same."]

    Well, judging by the economies of the Black world (including the AA collective), we obviously don’t know anything of value about economics. To me, that means that we’re really not in a position to critique the previously successful economies that others have been able to build for themselves. To me, it’s as ridiculous as the corner wino pontificating about macroeconomics.

    One can’t compare the current downturn in various Western European countries to their previous long-standing record of being able to provide for their own people. They have a track record of building economies that work. The modern Black world does NOT have this track record. And all the excuses that one can think of (colonialsim, slavery, etc.) don’t change this basic fact.

    For this purpose, it’s irrelevant that their previous centuries of prosperity were built on theft from the 3rd world—that’s the nature of any empire.

    Malcolm X said it the rough way. To paraphrase, he told AAs to “stop talking that equality talk. If you haven’t built for yourself and your kind what the WM has built for himself and his kind, then you’re NOT equal to that WM.”

    The colonialism excuses, rationales, explanations used to justfiy African and Caribbean nations’ mass FAILURES are very similar to the slavery and Jim Crow excuses, rationales, and explanations used to justify African-Americans’ mass FAILURES.

    Most Black countries have been officially free of colonialism for about as long as AAs have been officially free from Jim Crow. [With the exceptions of some holdouts like Angola, South Africa, etc.] The excuses are obsolete at this point.

    You said, “Rwanda, Tanzania, Mozambique and South Africa have equivalent economic power of Spain and Greece.”

    I’ll take your word for it. South Africa’s economy was built by Whites. And White South Africans still dominate that economy. So, let’s not inaccurately count that as a Black achievement. Rwanda is a good example of what’s wrong with many other countries in the Black world—they have extremely volatile and fragile politics.

    In healthy societies, an election dispute does NOT automatically mean that droves of people will run out into the streets and start attacking their neighbors with machetes. Which is what happened in the previously perceived as stable Kenya a couple of years ago. I won’t bother to expound on the genocide in Rwanda and how from all reports, it’s still an extremely fragile country. Given what they did, do you really feel that Rwanda is comparable to Spain or Greece?

    You said, “South Korea is not comparable since its in Pacific Asia and its economy and political structure have been propped up by the United States right along with Japan since WWII.”

    Respectfully, these are more excuses. Western international public aid has ALSO been propping up various Black countries. Especially during the Cold War.

    You said, “Its easy to judge Africa as a country, rather than a continent with its complex history. We only see the war and starvation, instead of those countries that are stable and considered strong functioning democracy from Tanzania to Mauritania.”

    I haven’t been talking about “Africa as a country.” Point blank, what I’m saying is that the Black world is a collection of FAILURES. The mass failure to build anything that other people flock to from around the world, the way that economic immigrants flock to Western Europe, the UK, and the US. I’m not even focused on war or starvation. I’m focused on the widespread economic failure relative to what a place like South Korea—which was bombed out and suffered massive starvation, by the way—has achieved (Hyundai, Samsung, etc.) in the same amount of time.

    It’s parallel to how the AA collective is a FAILURE. In both cases, Black folks have been officially free of colonialism or Jim Crow for roughly the past 50 years. In both cases, the time for excuses has run out.

    Finally, I wouldn’t be quick to call any African country “stable” or a “strong functioning democracy.” Folks said that stuff about Kenya. And then they had an election dispute a couple of years ago. And then LARGE numbers of folks apparently hit the streets with machetes and started slicing up their neighbors. One doesn’t expect something like that to happen in Western Europe. That’s some Rwanda and the former Yugoslavia-type of mess.

    Now, I do understand that much of this sort of thing stems from the artificially drawn borders derived from the colonial days. However, it’s 50-60 years later. The excuses are played out at this point.

    . . . Yes, we’ve hit several friendly “agree to disagree” points. :-) Here’s my last rotation about all of this:

    You said, “lastly, I have a friendly beef with you on this:

    You quoted me when I said: “South Africa’s economy was built by Whites. And White South Africans still dominate that economy. So, let’s not inaccurately count that as a Black achievement.”

    You said, “This sounds like a line I would expect from white south African and not an informed sister. South African economy is build on the backs of black Africans from the 1000s who died on mining under horrendous conditions, to the farmers who were uprooted from farming lands into shanti towns. White South Africans might have reaped the economic benefit under Apartheid, but those who enslaved for it were the blacks.

    This is comparable to Detroit or the other US cities that AAs have “inherited.” White people built the infrastructure that local Blacks ‘inherited’ in South Africa and US cities like Detroit. There’s a huge difference between inheriting something from somebody else and building it up from scratch.

    Of course, in both cases they used the labor of exploited Africans and AAs to build those magnificent industrialized cities and economic infrastructures. But their use of Black folks’ slave labor doesn’t erase the fact that THEY built it. They built that infrastructure, and to my knowledge modern Blacks haven’t built anything comparable to it.

    I have no problem with giving people, even an enemy, their “props” when seriously talking shop. And that’s what I consider these conversations to be—another space for some honest brainstorming. Excuses just won’t cut it anymore. Time has run out for all of that.

    Expect Success!

  24. Hodan says:

    Khadija: “Let me try to express this as gently and diplomatically as possible:

    I know it upsets you (as an African) to hear specific (and perhaps any) African countries spoken of in an unflattering light. However, the truth is the truth. I would respectfully suggest that you focus any displeasure and concern you feel on the African men who are committing atrocities—and the African women who enable them—instead of focusing this reaction on the people who refuse to tell lies to cover up for these particular Africans.”

    Hodan: I think you misunderstood me….to put it bluntly I could care less about any ethnic or racial pride. The truth hurts, but sometimes the truth spoken in constructive ways is more receptive to larger audience than a sweeping generalization about the whole black communities around the globe. Those of us who already know the $hit that dwells in our community and how best to extradited agree with you if not in every contents, but in principle.

    I think my liberal mindset tend to reject any generalization I might feel is being expressed on this particular post. Sometimes we all lump blacks together as if though they are of the same homogeneous social and political Diaspora. The experience of African American is not the same as those in the Caribbean let along Africa, a continent of 53 countries. I might be ‘African’ via my parents heritage, but as someone who is a Canadian bred and raised….I had the privilege of traveling to many countries blacks and otherwise. By and large, African countries whether they are a functioning democracy or not are completely different from the black community in North America. Unless we are discussing those few war torn countries like Congo and Sierra Leone….most are no different than any developing economies in Asia or Latin America.

    Khadija: “Speaking for myself, I REFUSE to cooperate in any way with large numbers of my AA sisters ending up like the women in the Congo, South Africa, Rwanda, or Haiti. And that includes my refusal to tell lies (by omission) about the misery that women live under in these countries.”

    Hodan: I don’t think any sane minded human being would expect you to do so. What I respectfully object to is concluding the horrible condition of Haiti, Congo as a basic standard for any black community around the globe. As you pointed out, in Yugoslavia and Russia, the rape was solely inflicted on opposing ethnic groups (mostly Muslim women and men). The same happened in Rwanda where the genocide by Hutu was inflicted on Tutsi tribe. Context is everything and it would help greatly if we can make comparison that is translatable to those of us in North America. No peaceful African country or culture would tolerate what takes place within our black communities here….in fact such crimes are predominate only in war torn countries. I would say, the dysfunction within the black community in North America is more comparable with some Muslim countries like Pakistan/Afghanistan.

    Now, I might be wrong and you can correct me on it….but you are talking about what is tolerated and even sometimes condoned in the black community is considered a crime in most other communities, White or Asians. I would agree with you there.

    Khadija: “I’ve never been silly enough to want to live in a Muslim country.”

    Hodan: yep, even though countries like Turkey, Tunisia, Senegal are pretty good to live in.

  25. Hodan says:

    By the way Khadija, wanted to say Ramadhan Mubarak to you and your loved ones…..same is extended to anyone fasting.

  26. Icon,

    You said, “Thank you for the quote Khadija and for this important (in fact LIFE PRESERVING) piece.”

    You’re welcome; and THANK YOU for having the courage to speak the truth in the first place. I saw your comment and thought to myself that this point really needs to be highlighted. AA women and girls are in EXTREME physical danger the longer they remain within Black residential areas. This is literally life and death we’re talking about here.

    Furthermore, this knee-jerk “hate the police” attitude will be the death of many AA women (and their helpless girl children). The brainwashing has AA women so confused that they can’t see that the police are the only organized entity standing between them and endless mass rape such as in the Congo.

    You said, “I’m not saying cops are not racist (usually this does involve frisking, harassing and searching black MEN not black women, but still, some cops are racist against black people collectively). So I already know some cops are racist. But so are higher education institutes, the workforce, etc., Should we forgo education and looking for work because of racism? So why is it that we believe we can “afford” to be anti-cop when our very immediate survival is threatened by danger just by being in close proximity to ANY area throughout the world where black men are the majority?”

    BW can’t afford to be anti-police. Considering the prevailing conditions within AA residential areas, it’s a suicidal attitude for AA women.

    You said, “LOL, true. And it’s interesting, Hurricane Katrina happened when I was an undergrad, all the pan-african super-seniors (usually ages 26-30 and male) preaching about the horror of it all did not go to New Orleans to volunteer. NOT ONE. And our school was offering academic credit for going. It was all liberal white college students that volunteered.”

    {chuckling}

    You said, “Anyway, it would be considered anti-BM to mention the lack of safety in black countries and communities. I noticed that the nationalists, pan africans, etc., I knew may “travel” but it’s usually NOT to areas where black people are the majority. It’s places like Egypt (I was there working on my senior thesis as a major in the arts, and most of the BM who went wanted to get a taste of “Afrikuh” through arab countries without traveling to black Africa, because of danger). And that’s EVEN IF they decide to go to Africa at all.”

    {more chuckling} So, these BM were more willing to deal with often racist Arabians (many of whom like to call Blacks the Arabic word for “slave” to their faces) than their Black African “brothers and sisters”? {outright laughter}

    You said, “No one brings up the so called “self sufficent” rhetoric in relation to the few IF ANY black male nationalists who’ve made the conscious decision to learn to hunt, plant a garden, and are not trying to learn. They/we are EXTREMELY dependent on white/ immigrant stores, doctors, medical supplies and so forth.”

    {more laughter} This is why I use Elijah Muhammad/Min. Farrakhan’s NOI as the “gold standard” when it comes to being serious about being an independent people. The NOI is the only surviving AA organization that has always been fully funded by Black folks. It’s the longest surviving AA organization that even bothers to speak the ideology of racial self-respect.

    Whether the NOI consistently practices racial self-respect is sometimes another issue. [There's (Elijah Muhammad's illegitimate son with one of his many light-skinned secretaries) Min. Ishmael Muhammad with the non-Black wife. There's the pre-existing issue that the man they worship as so-called "God in person"---the one they refer to as Master Fard Muhammad---was NOT Black. In fact, he looked White. White like the Kardashian tramps.] Be that as it may, the NOI is the only AA organization whose members have made concrete strides toward true self-sufficiency.

    You said, “I know for a fact life is not peaches and cream here in America, or other predominately white countries.”

    There will always be difficulties anywhere. But there’s NO comparison between the quality of life that BW can enjoy in the industrialized West versus places where BM rule. For every silly and/or indoctrinated AA woman who doesn’t understand this simple fact, there are probably at least 20+ African women who would LOVE to exchange places with that AA woman.

    You said, “I don’t mean to harp on black men, but it is clear that the only people consistently putting themselves in harms way and stressing about being a hypocrite to the movement ARE black women. With cops, and with everything else.”

    That’s not “harping.” The truth is the truth. AA women are the only ones consistently damaging their quality of life and putting themselves in harm’s way over some “Black” ideology. Ideology that AA men abandoned as soon as they got increased access to WW. This also applies to other types of BM—see Halima’s brilliant Who’s Zooming Who? post where she features photos of numerous African, supposedly anti-colonialist, Pan-Africanist leaders who made WW the very first First Ladies of their newly-independent African countries. Such as Angola’s first Black president and his White wife, Senegal’s first president and his White wife, Botswana’s first president and his White wife. Halima also mentioned,

    •Cheikh Anta Diop (yep the very one considered one of the greatest African historians of the 20th century a senegalese) married Louise Marie Maes, a French woman in 1953 in Paris.

    I need not mention the Harry Belafontes and other BM in the civil rights movement that were hooked up with WW. It turns out that the civil rights movement, Pan-Africanism and Black Nationalism have mostly been scams that self-serving Black male activists perpetrated on BW (in order to use BW’s resources as stepping stones to having increased access to non-Black women).

    Expect Success!

  27. Hodan,

    You said, “I think you misunderstood me….to put it bluntly I could care less about any ethnic or racial pride. The truth hurts, but sometimes the truth spoken in constructive ways is more receptive to larger audience than a sweeping generalization about the whole black communities around the globe. Those of us who already know the $hit that dwells in our community and how best to extradited agree with you if not in every contents, but in principle.”

    {breathing a sigh of relief that I was mistaken about what was driving your responses}

    You said, “I think my liberal mindset tend to reject any generalization I might feel is being expressed on this particular post. Sometimes we all lump blacks together as if though they are of the same homogeneous social and political Diaspora. The experience of African American is not the same as those in the Caribbean let along Africa, a continent of 53 countries.”

    I think we might be talking past each other with this. I haven’t heard anybody say that any of these various Black countries are “the same” as any other Black country. Nor have I heard anybody say that any of these places are “the same” as AA experiences or residential areas.

    In a nutshell, here’s what I’m saying:

    Since WWII, Western Europe has the been the “gold standard” in terms of being reasonably assured of personal physical safety and respect for the rule of law. These 2 attributes tend to have a positive effect on the economies of these countries. Add it all together, and these 3 factors are why droves of people from other areas of the world have been been beating down the doors trying to get into these countries.

    Nobody except folks from even-worse off neighboring Black countries is beating down the doors to get into or live in any Black country. Even the “stable” and “peaceful” countries in the Black world tend to be quite fragile and volatile underneath the surface. Like Kenya after an election dispute a few years back. I’m not saying that these Black countries are fragile or volatile in identical ways. Every country on the planet has its own unique dynamics.

    But the bottom line is that a tourist or anybody who relocates to these countries IS running a much larger, and much more uncertain experiment than they would be if they moved to Western Europe, the US, or Canada. Anything at all can “jump off” at any time in these fragile countries. They can go from “peaceful” and “stable” to machetes (Kenya) or firebombs in the streets (Thailand) overnight. I think about what if I had been a tourist in Kenya at the point when folks hit the streets with their machetes. The same thought applies to the recent political violence in Thailand.

    Western European countries, the US, Canada (and I suppose places like Australia) are just not volatile and fragile to the same degree as these other places. So, the inherent risk of going to/relocating to those places just isn’t as great.

    I’m also not saying that the Black world is unique in having fragile and volatile countries. There are places in Europe (such as Greece and Russia) that I’m skittish about for similar reasons. I was in a hurry to get in and out of Greece because of its volatile politics—they have not-infrequent street riots over politics. With Russia, the problem is with roving violent skinheads and organized crime—these folks have attacked and robbed visiting White American businessmen! Ethnic Russian coworkers have told some very disturbing tales about their recent visits to Russia.

    And I had to be talked into spending even a single day in Egypt because of the security concerns. And this was WITH a military escort of the tour buses—and WITH many of the areas where tourists went closed off to ordinary Egyptians. After what had happened at Luxor some years back, I’m not looking to be machine-gunned while sightseeing in Egypt (or any other Arab country).

    I haven’t talked about these fragile and volatile non-Black places because they’re not relevant to this conversation. My thing is that the same hell dimension that exists in certain Black countries (like the Congo, etc.) is starting up in AA residential areas in the US.

    You said, “Now, I might be wrong and you can correct me on it….but you are talking about what is tolerated and even sometimes condoned in the black community is considered a crime in most other communities, White or Asians. I would agree with you there.”

    I agree. This is why I’ve been telling sane AAs that it’s time for them to evacuate Black residential neighborhoods.

    You said, “yep, even though countries like Turkey, Tunisia, Senegal are pretty good to live in.”

    Well, again…we all have our different thresholds when it comes to running experiments with our safety. Out of those 3 countries, Turkey is the only one that I’d be willing to spend much time in. :-)

    Expect Success!

    • Zoopath says:

      @Khadija: You think like me in terms of what meets my personal level of safety. I do not take chances with even slightly unstable places or places that would be hostile to me because of my race, gender or nationality. I’m the only me I have and I am disinclined to spend money traveling to a place that’s more violent than where I normally live. Um, no.

  28. lafemmenoir says:

    “Yes, I believe any sensible person would run for their lives and leave those neighborhoods. I know it’ll sound cold as ice, but I don’t necessarily want these Deborah movement women to leave those areas. Since they’re that misguided, perhaps it’s safer for the rest of us that they DON’T leave and come among more normal people. I’m sure that these types of women would destroy any sanctuary by bringing their DBRBM sons, nephews, cousins and boyfriends with them to any new setting.”

    This is exactly why I do not correct people when they assume that I live in a diffrent community. They say, “oh, you live in Norridge, right?” and my response, “Yes, I live in Norridge.” I don’t have to say that I don’t live anywhere near Norridge do I? LOL

    I do not want these fools moving to my community and bringing DeQuandis their ex-con thug nephew/cousin/uncle/brother/baby-daddy with them.

    I have always tried to live in areas that were predominately white with the exception of my first apartment. It was all I could afford at the time. I was 18 and didn’t make a lot of money and I was in school. Once my neighbor got raped because she didn’t have the prerequisite bars on her window, I decided that it was time to move back to a neighborhood that was safe, heavily patrolled and white, like the one I grew up in. I didn’t care that I had to work a part-time job in addition to my full time job to do so or get a roommate.

    Fast forward to present- Where I live now, I had left my window open while I was on vacation for a week and no one broke in.

    In the past, when I had trouble with my DBRBM ex-husband, I called the police and they came and escorted his silly self away. When the white cop said to me not to let him back into my place my response to him was “I most definitely won’t.” and “where can I get a restraining order?” I do not have an issue with the police, they have helped me in more ways than I care to mention. One even helped me change the tire on my car and he was off-duty! Black women better realize that a white cop will keep you from getting your head bashed in or worse. And I must say that I agree that there is NO country in Africa where a woman is safe from harm. Black women need to disregard the “white man’s whore” label black men might want to throw on you because you seek refuge from madness in white communities. You will live long and prosper without their “help.”

    • Aisha says:

      “This is exactly why I do not correct people when they assume that I live in a diffrent community. They say, “oh, you live in Norridge, right?” and my response, “Yes, I live in Norridge.” I don’t have to say that I don’t live anywhere near Norridge do I? LOL

      I do not want these fools moving to my community and bringing DeQuandis their ex-con thug nephew/cousin/uncle/brother/baby-daddy with them.”

      This is a great idea! We have to be very careful about who we let into our “escape routes.”

      “Black women need to disregard the “white man’s whore” label black men might want to throw on you because you seek refuge from madness in white communities. You will live long and prosper without their “help.””

      This bears repeating.

  29. Hodan says:

    Khadija: I think we might be talking past each other with this. I haven’t heard anybody say that any of these various Black countries are “the same” as any other Black country. Nor have I heard anybody say that any of these places are “the same” as AA experiences or residential areas.

    In a nutshell, here’s what I’m saying:

    Since WWII, Western Europe has the been the “gold standard” in terms of being reasonably assured of personal physical safety and respect for the rule of law. These 2 attributes tend to have a positive effect on the economies of these countries. Add it all together, and these 3 factors are why droves of people from other areas of the world have been been beating down the doors trying to get into these countries.”

    Hodan: I agree with you…..I think we are arguing the same points in different context.

    Khadija: Nobody except folks from even-worse off neighboring Black countries is beating down the doors to get into or live in any Black country. Even the “stable” and “peaceful” countries in the Black world tend to be quite fragile and volatile underneath the surface. Like Kenya after an election dispute a few years back. I’m not saying that these Black countries are fragile or volatile in identical ways. Every country on the planet has its own unique dynamics.”

    Hodan: preaching to the quire here…..well in term of the black community. In my neighborhood, its been mostly people of southern Europe and Latin Americans background…..its a mixture of upper to middle class neighborhood….but like most Canadian cities, we have publicly funded building next to us and it has mostly black families. Most of them are fine, but some of them have created chaos in the neighborhood, where the police have to show up at lease ones a week. I know the superintendent who is originally from Barbados and she’s about to quit. She complains about how many of them take no pride for their property, damaging it and leaving garbage around….heck even some of them pee in the elevator. Not to mention their children who are outside attracting trouble from sunrise to sunset while their mothers party and no fathers around.

    Sometimes, we are our worse enemy….my mom is thinking of moving far away by next yr.

    Khadija: But the bottom line is that a tourist or anybody who relocates to these countries IS running a much larger, and much more uncertain experiment than they would be if they moved to Western Europe, the US, or Canada. Anything at all can “jump off” at any time in these fragile countries. They can go from “peaceful” and “stable” to machetes (Kenya) or firebombs in the streets (Thailand) overnight. I think about what if I had been a tourist in Kenya at the point when folks hit the streets with their machetes. The same thought applies to the recent political violence in Thailand.

    Hodan: yep, I remember my former boss when I was working in Kenya taking pride in how peaceful her country is and would never be volatile compare to Somalia or Sudan. I guess she forgot nothing is permanent in developing countries, Africa in particular.

    Khadija: Western European countries, the US, Canada (and I suppose places like Australia) are just not volatile and fragile to the same degree as these other places. So, the inherent risk of going to/relocating to those places just isn’t as great.

    Hodan: Let’s hope we keep it that way.

    Khadija: I’m also not saying that the Black world is unique in having fragile and volatile countries. There are places in Europe (such as Greece and Russia) that I’m skittish about for similar reasons. I was in a hurry to get in and out of Greece because of its volatile politics—they have not-infrequent street riots over politics. With Russia, the problem is with roving violent skinheads and organized crime—these folks have attacked and robbed visiting White American businessmen! Ethnic Russian coworkers have told some very disturbing tales about their recent visits to Russia.

    Hodan: Yep, a volatile country is not one any tourist wants to spend their money @. I prefer to stay close to home if not some place where I know my security would be @ minimum risk.

    Khadija: And I had to be talked into spending even a single day in Egypt because of the security concerns. And this was WITH a military escort of the tour buses—and WITH many of the areas where tourists went closed off to ordinary Egyptians. After what had happened at Luxor some years back, I’m not looking to be machine-gunned while sightseeing in Egypt (or any other Arab country).”

    Hodan: Egypt has an emergency dictatorship since the assassination of Anwar Sadat…..Cairo is the dirtiest city and just chaotic. My friend who’s parents are from there tried to live in the city and teach with her foreign husband for 2 yrs….they only lasted for one yr.

    Khadija: I agree. This is why I’ve been telling sane AAs that it’s time for them to evacuate Black residential neighborhoods.

    Hodan: My mom would agree with you.

    Khadija: Well, again…we all have our different thresholds when it comes to running experiments with our safety. Out of those 3 countries, Turkey is the only one that I’d be willing to spend much time in.

    Hodan: Turkey is great…..plan to visit including Cyprus next summer God willing.

  30. Icon says:

    Khadija

    “Furthermore, this knee-jerk “hate the police” attitude will be the death of many AA women (and their helpless girl children). The brainwashing has AA women so confused that they can’t see that the police are the only organized entity standing between them and endless mass rape such as in the Congo.”

    I agree, another thing is the knee-jerk “too many brothas in jail!” cheerleadering that black women engage in publicly without realizing that if criminal/some everyday black men had the power to, they would decriminalize rape, drug crimes, murder, child molestation and banish child support laws. I’ve seen many things, and I’ve never seen a group of black men discuss their anger and plans of what to do about the rape of black women and girls, or any other issue. White laws are truly the only thing standing between single black mothers and mass poverty (child support laws and social programs), an INCREASED amount of serial killers (drug wars=militia) and serial rapists in the black community JUST LIKE impoverished Africa.

    The other very noticeable similarity is the lack of concern of black women and children with the HIV epidemic globally and the infection of black women and girls intentionally. I’ve heard so many blacks claim there are more white male pedophiles and serial killers, when in actuality, it’s that whites have no problem exposing white male pedophiles for the safety of children. Blacks do. Whites have no problem warning vulnerable women about the symptoms of serial killers, rapists, etc., as you’ve stated above. Black folks do (because they don’t care). White folks have no problem looking out for missing white women and girls, forming neighborhood watches, and “snitching” about bad-seed white criminals and rotten behavior. Black folks do. In fact, molestation of black girls is ALREADY given a “pass” as are all other crimes targeting black women and black girls globally. Yeah, I definitely prefer the white criminal justice system, not because it is saintly, but because it is the ONLY form of protection against black men, who would not offer NOT EVEN ONE of the above unless forced by white society.

  31. ZooPath,

    You summed up my sentiments when you said, “I’m the only me I have and I am disinclined to spend money traveling to a place that’s more violent than where I normally live. Um, no.”

    Indeed!
    _____________________________________________________

    Lafemmenoir,

    You said, “Black women better realize that a white cop will keep you from getting your head bashed in or worse. And I must say that I agree that there is NO country in Africa where a woman is safe from harm. Black women need to disregard the “white man’s whore” label black men might want to throw on you because you seek refuge from madness in white communities. You will live long and prosper without their “help.””

    Indeed. And the flip side of this equation is that depending on so-called “conscious brothers” or “good BM” for your personal safety will get a BW and her children killed. This is because as I said in the post, AA men DON’T assume any responsibility whatsoever for Black women’s and children’s safety in their own neighborhoods. With the limited exception of the NOI, BM don’t provide any protection. AA women need to stop tripping about that fact, and see to their own survival (and their children’s survival).
    _____________________________________________________

    Hodan,

    You said, “Egypt has an emergency dictatorship since the assassination of Anwar Sadat…..Cairo is the dirtiest city and just chaotic. My friend who’s parents are from there tried to live in the city and teach with her foreign husband for 2 yrs….they only lasted for one yr.”

    Yeah, but the Luxor Massacre (of 50+ tourists) took place during this same emergency dictatorship. Yes, Cairo was dirty; and so was Athens when I was there last year (I think they were in the middle of a municipal garbage strike).

    You said, ” Turkey is great…..plan to visit including Cyprus next summer God willing.”

    Good for you! I would like to visit Turkey (and see some whirling dervishes in person :-) ).
    ____________________________________________________

    Icon,

    You said, “I agree, another thing is the knee-jerk “too many brothas in jail!” cheerleadering that black women engage in publicly without realizing that if criminal/some everyday black men had the power to, they would decriminalize rape, drug crimes, murder, child molestation and banish child support laws.”

    Ooh, guurl, yeah. That’s exactly what they would do. AA women better wake up and smell the coffee.

    You said, “In fact, molestation of black girls is ALREADY given a “pass” as are all other crimes targeting black women and black girls globally. Yeah, I definitely prefer the white criminal justice system, not because it is saintly, but because it is the ONLY form of protection against black men, who would not offer NOT EVEN ONE of the above unless forced by white society.”

    I agree. Indoctrinated AA women need to rethink all this “hate the police” stuff and be careful what they wish for (the WM-dominated police to leave Black residential areas alone). These silly BW just might get their wish. The mass AA culture of giving a pass to crimes against BW and girls reminds me of the tagline to one of the Aliens movies: “In space, nobody can hear you scream…”

    Indoctrinated AA women who are busy opposing the police don’t realize that their actions serve to convince non-Black power elites that there’s NO benefit to allocating resources toward policing Black neighborhoods. AAs will whine and bite the (police) hands that are protecting them—whether the police continue to protect them or not. So, why bother protecting a bunch of ingrates who believe in “stop snitching” madness? Why bother sending in police to protect ingrates who hate the police? There will come a day when the non-Black political elites (right now, these people are mostly White, but they will soon be Latino and Asian, like the political leadership in much of California) decide that it makes more sense to simply put peace walls around violent AA neighborhoods and call it a day.

    And these foolish, brainwashed, “hate the police” AA women are helping to bring that day closer. At which point, these “Deborahs” will literally be physically TRAPPED with the same BM criminals that they want to shield from the police and the National Guard. And then the “Deborahs” (and their unlucky daughters) will find out what it’s like to be a woman or girl in the Congo.

    Expect Success!

  32. ***Note to Readers***

    In making this new site the kind of project that’s sustainable for me over the long-run, I’ve had to streamline how I handle certain things. The comments section is one of them. What this means is that I’ll give substantive responses to those folks who enter the conversations early (as I did across the board at the previous blog).

    After each post is a couple of days old, I’ll generally continue to publish new comments from readers. (That meet the commenting guidelines as set forth at the previous blog—those who are unfamiliar can read the comment “box” at the previous blog.)

    But, after a each post is a couple of days old, I generally WON’T continue responding to new comments.

    In other words, I’ll continue to publish comments to this post, but I’m not going to reply to any more comments in this thread. FYI. Please feel free to continue talking among yourselves!

    Expect Success!

  33. calpurnia says:

    Thank You for defending the ‘white’ police officers. I say ‘white’ because many are black men and women, as well as other ethnicities

    • lafemmenoir says:

      Although the entire force isn’t white, we must acknowledge the fact that it is a system that was put in place by whites, thereby making it”white”. The POC who serve follow the manual and laws that were put in place by “whites”. I can’t speak to the effectiveness of having POC officers, as it seems like they all get flack from the public for one reason or another. If I had a choice, I would prefer to encounter a white cop, even if s/he is slightly racist, than a black one. This might sound a little like Uncle Ruckus from the Boondocks cartoon, but it is my preference. This personal preference is based on observations that I have made over the last 15 years. I am a people watcher, it is my thing. I noticed that white cops tend to be more sympathetic and fair across the board and typically don’t have chips on their shoulders, like the black cops that I have had the opportunity to observe. I have observed them in personal settings and publicly and I am never surprised by their actions. Are all black cops bad? No, they are not, but if I wanted to get someone who would be more than likely be sympathetic to my situation or needs, or one who is willing to help me outside of his “duty”, it would be the white cop who would do it. Hands down!

  34. C-Mama says:

    This is a compelling read. Hard to swallow and contains enough to make a woman think.

    The truth is, right now, for Black Women, there seems to be no real protectors for her except for the Police.

    Unless he’s her Father, brother, or uncle (and many times, most don’t even have that) – most women don’t know what it is like to feel that she has the protection of a man.

    I once knew the security of that. I knew what it felt like to call my brother, before I called the police, and quite a few times it worked out just like that.

    But the same folx that protect, took my brother away.

    Now, I live, not in fear, but with a certain amount of caution of black males. Not all, for sure, but definitely the ones I live near. They don’t seem to place value on the things I do, top among them being life.

    So, while a part of me reacts strongly to what you are saying, another part of me agrees wholeheartedly.

    This is definitely food for thought.

  35. **Temporarily dipping back into the conversation to respond to a particularly thoughtful comment**

    C-Mama,

    Before anything else, let me mention that I am sorry for your loss. May God rest your brother’s soul, and grant him peace.

    Thank you for your thoughtful comment. I like those sorts of comments, whether they agree or disagree. Thought is what moves productive conversations forward.

    You said, “This is a compelling read. Hard to swallow and contains enough to make a woman think.”

    Real life is filled with shades of gray. I’m sure we’ve all encountered bad apples who work in every field, including police work. However, here’s the question that AA women need to ask themselves:

    In whose presence are you AND your children physically safer—With the WM-dominated police? Or with random AA males?

    If we’re honest, AND we’re serious about safeguarding our own lives (and our children’s lives) then we’ll acknowledge the obvious, undeniable answer to that question.

    I find it deeply upsetting that conditions have reached this point within the AA collective. It wasn’t always like this. I was blessed to grow up surrounded by extremely protective, “old-school” AA men like my father (and the other married fathers in my neighborhood—which were the only kind of fathers that lived on my block). These protective, “old-school” BM have been replaced by a new breed of mostly fatherless, NON-protective Black males.

    Ironically, I used to be where some of the Baby-Girl Black Nationalist dissenters currently are. My experiences of finding out about the Dunbar Village Atrocity and watching the—

    1-Mostly indifferent online reactions of most self-proclaimed “conscious” BM to this atrocity (they basically yawned whenever it was mentioned—yawned and, without missing a beat, got right back to whining about their victimization by WM); AND

    2-the even worse, gangrapist-protecting responses of the local Florida NAACP chapter and Rev. Hot Comb—

    —shocked me out of the complacent, reality-denying Black Nationalist trance I had been in since college. The Dunbar Village Atrocity and Aftermath forced me to step back, and take a fresh, NON-ideological look at what the AA collective has become.

    Here’s what I saw once I took a fresh look: AAs are at the end of the road. This is it. Right now. Most of us are not going to make it—we’ll be entrenched in the permanent underclass that we’re forming in the US. The hip-hop-based cultural pathologies that we’ve bought into have become too far gone and too normalized among us to be reversed.

    And there won’t be any help coming from the outside. The same way other people go on with their lives and ignore the suffering in many African countries is the same way the emerging Latino and Asian political elites will ignore AAs. Post-Obama, the era of AAs being able to trade on White guilt is OVER. For a variety of reasons.

    The bottom line is that those AA women who don’t wake up and run for their lives RIGHT NOW will soon be physically trapped in AA Rwanda-Congo zones. And there won’t be anybody coming to rescue them or their helpless children. For everybody else, they and their suffering will be invisible and of NO concern. The same way Africa and Haiti are invisible. This process has already begun.

    AA women need to rethink this “hate the police” indoctrination that has them hating the ONLY protectors that are standing between them and Congo-like mass rape in Black residential areas.

    **Going back into “radio silence”**

    Expect Success!

  36. Felicia says:

    http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local-beat/Suffer-These-
    Crimes-in-Oakland-Dont-Call-the-Cops-98266509.html

    Suffer These Crimes in Oakland? Don’t Call the Cops
    Dozens of layoffs effective at midnight, barring last minute deal
    By LORI PREUITT and KRIS SANCHEZ

    Tue, Jul 13, 2010

    Oakland’s police chief is making some dire claims about what his force will and will not respond to if layoffs go as planned.
    Chief Anthony Batts listed exactly 44 situations that his officers will no longer respond to and they include grand theft, burglary, car wrecks, identity theft and vandalism. He says if you live in Oakland and one of the above happens to you, you need to let police know on-line.
    Some 80 officers were to be let go at midnight last night if a last-minute deal was not reached. That’s about ten percent of the work force. (update: THE 80 OFFICERS WERE LET GO)
    “I came here to build an organization, not downsize one,” said Batts, who was given the top job in October.

    Here’s a partial list: (PARTIAL list)
    burglary
    theft
    embezzlement
    grand theft
    grand theft:dog
    identity theft
    false information to peace officer
    required to register as sex or arson offender
    dump waste or offensive matter
    discard appliance with lock
    loud music
    possess forged notes
    pass fictitious check
    obtain money by false voucher
    fraudulent use of access cards
    stolen license plate
    embezzlement by an employee (over $ 400)
    extortion
    attempted extortion
    false personification of other
    injure telephone/ power line
    interfere with power line
    unauthorized cable tv connection
    vandalism
    administer/expose poison to another’s

    Negotiations are going on at Oakland City Hall in the mayor’s office.
    Batts said the 80 officers slated to be laid off – mostly new officers – are “pretty sad and pretty depressed,” and those feelings are shared by the Police Department as a whole.
    The Oakland City Council voted June 25 to eliminate the positions to help close the city’s $32.5 million funding gap. According to the city of Oakland, each of the 776 police officers currently employed at OPD costs around $188,000 per year. Most of the officers who will be affected by the layoffs were on the streets of Oakland when Johannes Mehserle’s involuntary manslaughter conviction caused riots last Thursday.
    The sticking point in negotiations appears to be job security. The city council asked OPD officers to pay nine percent of their salary toward their pensions, which would save the city about $7.8 million toward a multi-million dollar deficit. The police union agreed, as long as the city could promise no layoffs for three years. No dice, says city council president Jane Brunner.
    “We wish we could offer them a three-year no layoff protection we just can’t financially. It would be irresponsible of us,” Brunner said. The city agreed to a one-year moratorium on layoffs, but it is not enough for the union.
    The problem is money. In the last five years, the police budget — along with the fire department budget — have amount to 75 percent of the general fund. After years of largely sparing those departments the budget ax, now it appears there are few other places to cut.
    These are the last hours of negotiation and Brunner is hopeful that the city and police will find some sort middle ground.
    “It’s been very good conversation and not a whole lot of grandstanding.” Brunner said. “There’s actually real conversations. Each side understands the problem,” she said.

  37. Miss V says:

    @ Khadijah: as usual, a very very thought provoking post. I NEVER even thought about this issue. And you’re absolutely right, the ONLY thing standing between black women/children and mass rapes/murders ARE the police.

    I recall saying to a bm several years ago something to the effect of how as black women we can’t go to bm for protection, and he (like you said) yawned, and kept on talking about black male victimization by wm. The irony is that he has a daughter. I wonder how he’ll feel in a few years when she reaches adolescence and finds herself dealing with dbrbm…hmm…

    @lafemmenoir: Black women need to disregard the “white man’s whore” label black men might want to throw on you because you seek refuge from madness in white communities. You will live long and prosper without their “help.”

    Me: ’nuff said.

  38. **Audience Note**

    I periodically take mini-sabbaticals away from the gadgets. I’m about to begin one such sabbatical around 10 minutes from now (at around midnight). While I’m away from the computer, the comments to the recent posts will be temporarily turned off.

    I plan to return to the computer (and blog) on Monday, August 30, 2010—I will enable the comments when I return.

    Expect Success!

  39. [...] right. As discussed in this post, White male-dominated law enforcement personnel are the only organized group of male protectors [...]

  40. [...] whatever Oppositional Defiant Disorder-based attitude you might have about the police. After all, White Male-Dominated Law Enforcement Is The Only Thing Standing Between You And Mass Rape In Black N…. The life you save by dropping this knee-jerk, anti-police attitude might be your [...]