If You Want To Live Well, Let Go Of The “Keeping It Real” Trickbag

THE FOLLY OF KEEPING IT REAL

During a recent conversation, Evia, blog host of Black Female Interracial Marriage Ezine talked about how many African-American women unwittingly act in ways that are unattractive and severely limit their social maneuverability. She said,

Okay . . . re how to talk without saying anything much, it’s actually a dynamic process and specifics depend on the situation. It’s a survival skill. Mainly, you never, ever say anything that will come back to bite you or others like you in the butt.

[Another reader had asked:] Also why do I need wiggle room, if I’m representing myself, and I only plan to be myself?

You need wiggle room to enhance your surviving and thriving. None of us can predict life, so you must always give yourself a way out or space to switch up–just in case.

This goes back to the way some bw see themselves–as serious, always telling the whole TRUTH, being responsible, hardworking, plodding along putting one foot ahead of the other, etc. like stodgy mules–even though it doesn’t work to their benefit in lots of cases, obviously.

Self-Image. I would like instead for AA women to think of themselves as and cultivate the image of charming butterflies that flutter around. Such a butterfly would never make heavy statements or limit itself to showing only one side of itself. It knows it needs wiggle room so that it can keep on fluttering wherever and be seen. LOL! People like having that type of butterfly around. It’s lighthearted. It’s delightful to look at, but no one expects it to do anything concrete or memorable. That’s not what a butterfly does.

That butterfly could actually be very shrewd, could be moving with stealth, but no one would ever expect it to be and it sure won’t tell ALL. If you’re always just being “yourself,” you limit your movement drastically.

For ex. when I’m around practically any male (preteen to 95), I behave like a charming butterfly because that always works to my advantage with men (even with very young males). It makes that male feel good. That’s a win-win situation for both of us. That’s not the “real” me; that’s just one of my FACES. Note: I fortunately don’t have to spend any time around any ghetto-acting male.

Mules. Mules have to DO concrete things. They’re expected to act like mules at all times. People don’t particularly like to look at them, but they’re necessary. Too many AA women have decided to look and act like mules. People put pressure on mules that they would never put on a butterfly. Very few people would pressure a butterfly to answer a question because that delightful creature might–gasp!–fly away.

It has to do with the way a woman thinks about herself. This is what she projects.

You should NEVER present your “real” self to strangers. WHY would you do that? Only do that with others who’ve earned your trust. We all can cultivate many faces and if you haven’t done that, you should work on that ASAP. Unfortunately, many bw will ‘let it all hang out’, but when others use some of that as a noose for them, they have no wiggle room or way out.

Talk, be lighthearted, but keep it moving. Smile, be charming, but be evasive–like a butterfly. If you’re evasive long enough, the typical person will back off and go on to the next person. If the person persists, use what they’re asking you to change the subject or smile and start to remove yourself from their presence (like the butterfly). Say, “Excuse me, but I’ve got to finish doing . . .” or simply “I’ve got to go.”

Always remember though that you don’t EVER have to answer anyone’s intrusive questions IF you don’t want to do so–unless in a court of law or similar situations. You don’t have to talk to people just because they want to talk to you. I’ve been criticized for not talking to certain people online, but I KNOW I don’t have to talk to anyone if I don’t want to do so, and just because someone asks me a question doesn’t mean I have to answer. Ebonically speaking, “They ain’t nobody!” I talk if I CHOOSE to talk or answer. We all can make that choice.

The basic issue here is one of boundaries, as Khadija has pointed out, and as I pointed out about those “nice guy” males. You have to have boundaries when dealing with any other person. You have to believe down deep inside yourself that the inner you belongs to no other human being, but YOU, and that NO ONE must cross your boundaries. No other human being has the right to cross those boundaries to access inner areas of you or even any of your outer assets unless you CHOOSE, in your best interests, to give them permission. Here’s the clincher. In any interaction with another human being, virtually all of the time (except for maybe with your children), YOU are the primary person–the MOST important person. No one else is as important as you to yourself. No one. This is why the subtitle of my first book is “First and Foremost.” You have to believe that you are NUMBER 1.

In response, a reader named Tracy said,

Evia, for some reason, “butterfly” is very difficult for bw to grasp, simply because when you dare to walk around happy and bright eyed, you are called “fake” or , God forbid, “white”..

I truly believe that the phrase “Keeping it Real” was invented to keep bw in Mule/Sista Soldier mode. Real means letting it all hang out, not thinking thru or controlling your emotions, and basically not caring about the image you are projecting. It’s easy to be “real.” The girls that I mentored in church had the hardest time with being “fake” because they were always having to think about what was coming out of their mouths, what they were wearing, and yes even their facial expressions. I would try to get them to think of something funny or happy that would make them smile, or to soften their expressions – but sadly some of them couldn’t even muster a good thought.

The scariest part of all – the sharing. The only thing these girls wanted to talk about was tearing down some other girl. Or the last fight they had. Or a beatdown that they saw recently. THAT made them smile…I understand teenage cliques, but I believe that in some circles, it may be a matter of safety for them to be a “real” or “down” Mule – Butterfly’s could be crushed easily. Still, hopefully some of them will remember and use their lessons later on in life.

(emphasis added)

A CRASH COURSE IN FEMININE GRACE FOR RECOVERING MULES

There are resources that explain and teach more attractive behavior. The kind of comportment that will better serve those African-American women who are seeking abundance in every area of life. Melina, blog host of The Art Of Being Feminine, has an entire blog dedicated to the feminine arts. Specifically, tips and techniques for becoming “a feminine, womanly, mysterious, and ideal woman.” I believe the information Melina is sharing is extremely important for any woman who wants to live well. Here’s a suggestion I’ve previously given to the feminist ideologues among the audience:

TRY NOT TO HAVE KNEE-JERK RESPONSES AGAINST THE “ART OF BEING FEMININE” BLOG BASED ON OTHER WOMEN’S CONTEXTS

Let me repeat an observation that I made in an earlier post,

African-American women often buy into ideas that have no real relevance to their particular circumstances. This often comes up whenever Black women discuss the importance of marriage.

When analyzing ideas, Black women should keep their own circumstances in the forefront. African-American women are operating in a context that no other group of women are operating in. Other women may face similar issues, but at nowhere near the rate of African-American women. Black women need to stop tripping, recognize that other women’s context is not our context, and respond accordingly.

African-American women are operating in a context of a huge unmarried rate (relative to all other types of people) and a 70 percent-plus illegitimate child rate. In this context, African-American women can’t afford the luxury of calling ourselves “overcoming” the perception that we want legitimate marriage—just like every other race and ethnic group of women on the planet.

To paraphrase some other important points that Halima has made in earlier comments and blog posts:

Unlike the White female theorists who can afford to characterize marriage as a site of oppression, African-American women need to understand that marriage is important as a potential site for division of the hard work involved in raising children. Unlike the current situation where African-American women are bearing almost sole responsibility for raising Black children (as is clear from the 70 percent-plus out of wedlock rate).

Unlike women from other ethnic and racial groups, African-American women are being targeted for male disassociation and social disfellowship.

White women are generally protected and provided for within overall White American society (see the examples of how David Letterman and Kanye West were quickly chastised for publicly demeaning a White woman). White women can afford to talk that stuff about how they refuse to be “obsessed with marriage”—because they’re already reaping the benefits of marriage!

African-American women can’t afford the luxury of characterizing desire for marriage as “obsession” with marriage. African-American women are suffering the real consequences of the absence of marriage within the African-American collective. Consequences like the physical danger posed by legions of (mostly fatherless) predatory, violent criminals. Physically dangerous environments like Dunbar Village are one of many results of an absence of stable, two-parent families created by marriage.

I’m not talking about marriage as somehow saving the African-American collective. I’m talking about how the mass absence of marriage is drastically lowering the quality of Black women’s lives. And sometimes, such as within many Black residential areas, is creating physical danger to Black women.

White women and other women can afford to “trip,” and pretend like they don’t know the reasonable availability of marriage opportunities within their own group is doing something good and important for them (and their children). African-American women can’t afford to “trip” like that.

Don’t let the things you don’t like about that particular blog stop you from picking up pearls of wisdom that can enhance your life! A woman having feminine skills plus 21st century freedom of movement (especially in the Western world) is an extremely powerful combination!

AS YOU TAKE YOUR RIGHTFUL PLACE ON THE GLOBAL STAGE, WAIVE GOODBYE TO KEEPING IT REAL

Ladies, “keeping it real” does not serve you well in the non-ghetto, global village. As an astute blogger named Focused Purpose has put it, “release your grip on that trickbag.” Quickly, if you want to thrive in the outer world.

*Audience Note* I’m extremely busy at the moment with some business projects, so I’ll mostly sit back and listen during this conversation. Please feel free to talk among yourselves.

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78 Responses to “If You Want To Live Well, Let Go Of The “Keeping It Real” Trickbag”

  1. Felicia says:

    From my POV, one of the first, most important, and best things to do in order to release one’s inner butterfly, is to drop this emotional connection/attraction to other black folks who have not proven that they have your best interest and full freedom in mind. Which these days would be 99.9% of black people for most BW.

    Because as long as that emotional connection/attraction/dependance is there, these other blacks (total strangers even in many cases) will have the power to control you, your thoughts, and actions.

    They will have the power to keep you in mule mode because you will care what they think about you.

    When you stop caring what dysfunctional anti-BWE/BWIR black others think about you – and realize that they don’t matter in the grand scheme of things – and are powerless, you naturally sprout your wings and fly like the beautiful butterfly you are.

    These days – in the majority of cases – the ONLY ones who earnestly and seriously care about ANYTHING related to blackness, is black women. And this train of thought hasn’t gotten BW ANYWHERE FAST.

    Sisters need to lay that burden down for good and sprout those wings. Fly FAR away from Hell pits and Hellish anti-BWE/BWIR sentiments/mindsets. Into the light and the GLOBAL community where human norms and traditional gender roles are STILL in practice in the majority of cases.

    My two-cents and enjoy the weekend all!

    • ak says:

      Felicia:

      From my POV, one of the first, most important, and best things to do in order to release one’s inner butterfly, is to drop this emotional connection/attraction to other black folks who have not proven that they have your best interest and full freedom in mind. Which these days would be 99.9% of black people for most BW.

      Because as long as that emotional connection/attraction/dependance is there, these other blacks (total strangers even in many cases) will have the power to control you, your thoughts, and actions.

      These days – in the majority of cases – the ONLY ones who earnestly and seriously care about ANYTHING related to blackness, is black women. And this train of thought hasn’t gotten BW ANYWHERE FAST.

      Yes Felicia this is all true and yes BM gave up blackness a long time ago even the ones who still ‘talk’ it. I think the only reason why they grow locs and ‘fros is just so that white people will say their hair looks ‘so cool’ and will start to talk to them, especially the women.

      I have only just now caught a clue FINALLY regarding keeping my business private, being an elusive ‘butterfly’, and practicing showing my different faces. For too many years now from when I was younger and even though I am a quiet, shy, and retiring person who feels awkward meeting new people sometimes, I’d always shortly be too honmest and truthful about my thoughts, feelings, and plans with or without probing and it always used to bite me in the posterior. If somebody at work or even outside of work kept probing, and I’d easily give in would they give up up any information if I asked it? No and then they’d ‘close’ the conversation and move on as soon as they got what they wanted and I’d always feel hurt and suckered. You also have the people who always observe by watching you and listening to you, at work for instance, with their fake smiles on who would then use your business that they found out about you against you, or they’d blab it to everybody.

      I think the reason why I’d be so prone to blabbing honestly was because I wanted to be liked, not difficult, because I had no idea of boundaries and how to maintain them, and also because I saw certain people, usually other women, who blabbed about themselves and others to everybody else at work or outside of work too, but I noticed that I never saw those blabbermouths getting punished for all of their babbling, it was only me it felt like. Sadly, I really tied a noose for myself.

      I didn’t really land others in trouble though, it was usually just myself. The betrayal I received from not giving myself any wiggle room came from black, white, men, women, or whatever.

      I only just learnt my lesson from somewhere I used to work last year and a foreign black woman I used to work with; that was horrible but I must admit I’m learning from her because she had the many faces, and even lying down pat! She was the type who’ll try to go as far as she can to get where she wants to be.

      My own mother who of course I should have listened to from FOREVER said ‘don’t let none of these people know your business’ and people flock to my mother and just love her! And she always has a pleasant face on, but she doesn’t like people knowing hjer business and even though she is an antiseptic neat freak she doesn’t even like a lot of people (friends) in and out of her house. My Mom doesn’t even tell people she went to high school/nursing school with, who are friends with her to this day and my godparents in some cases, all of her business and she’s not a shady or criminal character.

      Hindsight is painfully 20/20 though. And a lot of what I’ve been on the end of with my ‘concrete’ and ‘memorable’ mule-y ways has left me feeling jaded, to make a fellowship with people to create a special-interest community/solidarity/alliance with them. I wish I did things the way Revolutionaryandjoyful did back in Khadija’s last post, although the way she regards humanity I can’t judge her for that because I’m inclined to agree with her most of the time now.

      I really can’t stand a person, nor the agenda of the person who asks you a question that you decline to answer, and then they’ll ask you the same question a few minutes later, or later on in the day, or even a few days later. Who wouldn’t dislike humanity when you’ve met a few people like this, inside or outside of work! There’s also the dreaded person who says things like ‘Somebody said such and such about you, but I can’t tell you who said it’. All so childish and middle school-ish which is why thankfully I haven’t really come across that for a long, long time!

      Roll on more therapy please, because I really need to learn some lessons to change my life for the better and the far better!!

      • ak says:

        My mother has said many times that ‘A silent river always runs deep’ which is probably why some people always use the other saying ‘It’s always the quiet ones…’!

        So now it’s time for me to be that silent river instead of such a ‘babbling brook’!

  2. MsMellody says:

    Great post, and very very timely subject for me personally.

    I recently traveled to a Southwestern state to visit some of my husband’s relatives. I specifically understood that this was going to be an opportunity to actually USE all that I have read and re-read over this past year or so at this and other BWE blogs .

    Well let me just say that this phenomenon of dropping the mule behavior absolutely came to mind at some of the most important moments during my visit.

    When meeting my husbands extended relatives/family I knew that they had “heard” about his marrying a Black woman..and I instinctively knew that this invitation was really two fold. It was an opportunity of course for these family members to see my husband and of course it was an opportunity for these people to judge exactly what kind of Black woman this man has married.

    I was scrutinized first at a solo-dinner. Solo in the sense that the youngest family member “just had to meet us for dinner”..now mind you this was exactly 2 (two) hours after our plane landed and we had arrived at our hotel. Anyone who has traveled knows that one basically requires a few hours of rest/re-hydration before meetings/dinners/parties etc. But when the call came and I saw how excited and happy my husband was, I felt that it would have been rude for me not to go. Looking back I see that this was a crucial mistake.

    I should have rested, and rehydrated and got my intro look totally
    together. So I am sharing this point for any other Black woman in this position in the future. Be shrewd and wise. Because this family member did indeed come to this impromptu dinner invite looking ravishing. I however was tired, but I was light and friendly and was quiet and let the family member and her husband do the requisite “catching up”.

    Allow me to add this also, by the time the invites for the rest of the week’s festivities came in I was much more prepared. I will never forget one family member’s new husband looking me up and down from across the room and before we said our final goodbyes he came over and asked me “So were you born and raised in [Major MidWestern City]? Now I have to share this bit of back ground so anyone reading this will understand how much of a compliment this was to me.

    All my adult working life – I have been posed with this question. Because as it was explained to me at one of my jobs- I didnt come off as a “typical Black woman”..it was explained to me that I didnt go around all frowned up/ mean muggin’ ( if I can use Ebonics here lol!) I was also told that I didnt have “that attitude” that a lot of Black women have, that I smile all the time..and that I am just really nice and that “all the white men here like you”….

    Yes these were the exact words that an older Black woman at a prior workplace said to me. I never forgot those words, and often thought about them because they seemed to explain to me why I always seemed to have little problems of attitude coming from other Black women at this workplace.

    So..back to this SouthWestern state family visit. So as we were leaving this particular family member of my husband – asked me that question ..and keep in mind his( male family member) voice and tone was full of ” wow..she doesnt seem like all the other Black women I had encountered”..also keep in mind this particular family member of my husband also grew up in my Midwestern City …so his voice also told me that his question was sincere.

    Ladies, if you are a recovering mule please drop the “attitude”, read Melina’s blog..I have read it quite often/ and I still read it for tips/tools/ and reminders of the powerful feminine mystique.

    Thanks Khadija for a great post.

  3. joyousnerd says:

    I think sometimes that BW embrace the keeping it real meme because it is fail-proof. When you try to show decorum you risk making a mistake. There are no mistakes to make when you let it all hang out.

    • ak says:

      But keeping it real already makes you make the biggest mistake of them all: Giving ‘them’ a noose to string you up with. You don’t need anymore little mistakes other than that because that already defeats you.

  4. Rebecca says:

    When I was in junior high my mother enrolled me in a 1-year co-ed cotillion program. I HATED it, LOL, as I was still in my tomboy phase, but looking back, I am so very glad my mother made me go.

    I think it was the first time in my life I ever felt like a girl, and like a pretty girl for that matter. Once a week for a whole year I had to get out of my basketball uniform and put on a dress with heels and stockings and interact socially with boys (and girls) my age. Other than manners and style, I learned other things like how to dance, how to accept a man’s chivalrous gestures, etc. I think the experience definitely had an impact on my self-image, which unfortunately is something that I think a lot of black women never really get to properly develop in the formative years. I feel like oftentimes black girls get separated into two categories: bookish ugly ducklings or overly sexualized future vixens.

    Sidenote: One of my girlfriends is in the end stages of completing a style and etiquette book for teen girls and I’ll be sure to let you know when it is finally published.

  5. Felicia says:

    “These days – in the majority of cases – the ONLY ones who earnestly and seriously care about ANYTHING related to blackness, is black women. And this train of thought hasn’t gotten BW ANYWHERE FAST.”

    To be clear, the above statement is in reference to sister solider/mule like behavior. Basically, caring and doing for ungrateful people who do not reciprocate, and working on behalf of causes that do not benefit you in the end,

  6. Hi all!

    I know I need to get Evia’s book(s) but I was wondering if any of you could give me advice on what butterflies talk about. I said in the previous conversation that I’m good at not letting out too personal information too soon but I’m now realizing that outside of that I don’t really know what to say. For example, if I am in a conversation with a small to large group of people I generally don’t speak unless I think I have something of import to say. Which often means that when I do speak it’s about something I care / am passionate about I know I can come across as aggressive.

    Also, I’ve read in a lot of places that you don’t want to bring up heavy topics with men you are interested in too soon. I kinda get why but then I think how deeply do you get involved with a man before you start bring up subjects that could be deal-breakers such as, whether or not to have children, how to raise children, where you will live, whether to have one parent stay at home, etc?

    Any books, resources, etc that give concrete advice in that area would be great.

    • HR Professional says:

      Revolutionary and Joyful,

      Thank you for posing that question. I have the exact same problem. After I run out of pleasantries e.g. great weather, how are the children? Tell me more about your new car, etc. I am at a loss for more conversational topics that do not delve into my personal life. I hope someone can speak on this subject.

      • Truth P. says:

        It depends on the people you are around.
        After you have spoken about the weather,children,car etc.You could compliment a person on what they are wearing or something else.Just keep it light hearted.

        I actually recently have started to allow others to decide the topic of conversation.Then I decide whether I will chime in after I have considered what i’m going to say first and the impact it may have.If you are around new people, and you have issues with communication, i’d suggest that you float around the room like a butterfly until you find the chatter box of the room.They’ll do alot of the talking for you.If they are the joke telling type just laugh.But not too hearty with the laughter.

        Remember when you allow others to decide the topic of conversation the chatter will eventually end.When it does there may be awkward silences but YOU DON’T HAVE TO BE THE ONE TO SPEAK UP AND FILL THE SILENCE.

        DON’T FEAR THE AWKWARD SILENCE!There is nothing wrong with the brief silences.Sometimes you may not have anything to say and it is best to think of what you are going to say BEFORE you actually say it.When you fear those brief silences you may feel the urge to say something,just anything to fill the moment but just saying anything is not good.Especially not if you want people to have a good perception of who you are intellectually.

      • tertiaryanna says:

        I like to talk about hobbies, books, music or art. The good thing about the last three is that they’re easily found in public libraries, so it’s a free education.

        You don’t need to know a lot, just find some things you like and learn about them. If you’re not sure where to begin, just pick a genre and start from there. The reference librarians are an excellent resource.

        If a person is familiar with the work, it’s a topic that you have in common. If not, it’s a chance to show enthusiasm about a topic, and that invites your conversation partners to open up about topics that interest them.

        Because of my financial priorities, I don’t often go to live performances, so I tend to stick to the classics. That allows me to see things that have been performed often, and that I can see by just visiting the library. So I haven’t seen “Wicked”, but I can hold my own in a conversation about “Macbeth”.

        I don’t know a lot about sports, but that’s also a good topic for casual conversation. If you don’t know much about it, it’s even easier to keep it casual, and invite the other person to talk about who they like and why.

    • The best butterflies are always great observers. After talking about the weather, traffic and family well-being, personal appearance is always a good topic to discuss. I always have a few things up my sleeve-a really unique restaurant I’ve gone to, a progressive art exhibit that I want to see, local weekend happenings, and something lighthearted or profoundly interest on television (maybe a cute commercial or a great show on the History Channel.) Butterflies ask lots of questions but in an nonobtrusive way. The more that teh othe rperson talks, the less that the butterfly has to say 🙂

      • MsMellody says:

        Miss Glamtastic!!! Wow that observation about what a Butterfly is was exactly on point!!

        In a few words you captured the true essence of what a Butterfly is.. Without sounding overly poetic..a butterfly….she is shrewd quiet and observant of the surroundings. Taking in the unspoken and spoken conversation the variances therein..she makes no noise with her wings, yet lands effortlessly, always bringing light beautiful but thought provoking comments or inquiries.

        I came back to this post because I kept thinking about some of the lady’s here inquiries about what exactly is a butterfly in terms of these spoken and unspoken social graces. I just wanted to applaud your description!! And just add this;

        Being open to the conversation at hand – despite ANY misgiving you might have unless you are asked directly BUT even then be ready to state GRACIOUSLY your opinion and ALWAYS ALWAYS REMEMBER this one thing – AVOID at ALL COSTS any conversation of controversy and or gossip. If the cocktail convo is heading in that direction – immediately excuse yourself with the patented “Oh I see Walter from accounting is here I just must go and say hello, please excuse me” – or something to that affect.

        As you younger and even us older Black women continue to take to this stage of universal introduction ( b/c remember there ARE some groups of people who have NEVER met or talked with a Black woman other than in passing or in some service capacity )you and I are literally the AMBASSADOR to US so handle your role in this intro to the BETTER of your abilities. Notice that I said to the BETTER of your abilities – that means “when you know Better you DO BETTER”!!

        Be gracious, warm, lively keep it light. And yes DONT worry about the silences, it’s okay..others may have run out of something to talk about, and it is NOT your responsibility to carry the convo. Maybe after a few moments you can mention that ” the ensemble players guitar work sounds lovely”..or something like that – then move on to another group after the appropriate few moments of conversation.

        I find that in those moments of quiet or when I am not in a little group talking I try think pleasant thoughts and remember how far I have come to even be at this point in my life so that I can broadcast on my face that I am happy and open to life.

        Just my little pointers.

  7. Lisa99 says:

    MsMellody, I get the same reaction about being born and raised in “Major Midwestern City” and attending public schools in “Major Midwestern City.” I can tell that various white folks are rather confused because my bearing and demeanor (and college education) is not supposed to be seen among black folks from… “Major Midwestern City.”

    Wonder if we’re from the same one? 😉

    • MsMellody says:

      Hi Lisa99

      If your Major Midwestern City is spoken of as the “City with The Big Shoulders”..or ..The Second City” then yes!!!

      I get that reaction too…I even get that reaction from Black people right here locally..can you believe that!! I mean all I am is a positive happy joyous Black woman..without said “mean mug” …and I have always just known that the world was bigger than my street or neighborhood.

      • mobile68 says:

        Ms Mellody,

        Did you meet your husband in your hometown?

        When I went to other places in America, particularly the west coast, white and other non-AA people would draw to me like water to a sponge. And their reactions to me would be like the ones you received from your hubby’s family.

        Now that this mule’s time is almost up (with being a wife to and ungreatful BW & mother to a corrupted-by-a-BM(aka her father)daughter) I can’t get out of this city of big shoulders fast enough!

        I always suspected that where you live makes a difference in you being happy or not.

        • MsMellody says:

          Hi Mobile 68 !!

          Yes the City of the Big Shoulders is my very own hometown. And YES I did meet my husband in my little bitty hometown (lol)…BUT guess what- I met him ONLINE!!

          I have also dated interracially right here, lived on the North end of town and found that that was the best for me.

          I have preached this story to so many of my single black girlfriends and they seem to FINALLY be listening- MOVE to a place where you will feel more comfortable and be the better that you can be.

          Move to a racially diverse area that is more white than black ( YES I SAID IT !!!) enjoy the white skin privilege of shops, little boutique specialty stores, low crime, high property value, condo associations that work, street repairs that are done promptly due to the “Ol’ City of Big Shoulders Way” , book fairs, etc etc. This would be the kind of neighborhood that an upwardly mobile white man will feel comfortable coming to meet you to pick you up for dinner dates/ theater dates etc. And I am going to be a meddling Aunt here and tell you young women that white men look at how you (meaning ANY woman ) spend your money.
          Yes they do!! They do not want to marry ANY WOMAN who shows them that they cannot handle simple finances, they WANT to marry and DO WELL in life.

          So if you are single and have NO OOW children, pack your belongings move to an area that is nice/clean and safe and racially diverse ( more White than black – yeah I said it again!!!) move into a studio in a really nice condo or apt building vet-date-vet-date-then marry!!!
          He will see that you are SENSIBLE with your monies, that you have a “good head on your shoulders” and that you can be trusted to hear about and ULTIMATELY ENJOY & JOIN IN his business plans/ future real estate plans/ trust funds/ inheritance etc., etc.

          And on a personal note – the husband drove for full hour in traffic to date me and then we moved to his “neck of the suburban woods” and the rest is a romantic love story -still being written!!

    • T says:

      Years ago, when I worked my first job out of college, a woman told me that I was not like many black people she knew. I wanted to ask, “what kind of black people you know?” but I knew the answer to that. The same monolithic black people she’s always known.

  8. ak says:

    I like Melina’s three recent posts she has about the Mentally Unstable Man, The Man Who Wants To Improve You and Change You, and Is Your Man Jealous? . It’s good at least that she’s recognising that sometimes it’s ‘just them’, but yes I like her blog too.

  9. T says:

    I made a comment about this very topic about three years ago (note to self, of course). My conclusion is that BW are so attached to the “race woman” philosophy, that they cannot and will not cultivate the feminine qualities that you speak of here. It sounds too much like being “white” or a “sellout.” That said, BW absolutely MUST get out of the mule/sister soldier/”race woman” ways and embrace the wider world around her. Keeping it real has done nothing for BW but get them more ostracized and more marginalized. Why continue this madness?

  10. sisterlocgirl says:

    Hi ladies! As always a wonderful post. I suppose I get my butterfly tendencies from my mother. It always amazes me when I walk around work during the day in ” Major Midwestern City ” and observe the scowls, frowns and generally unpleasant demeanor of many bw. I smile all the time, greet everyone I encounter with an appropriate greeting and generally try to be pleasant to be around. Having a happy disposition makes me a happier person and hopefully I can spread a little joy to others as well. No one wants to talk to someone who looks like she’s been sucking on brine soaked lemons all day with chasers of bitter coffee. And if I may add, looking like a woman helps as well. I’m not into clownish makeup at all, but I never leave the house without my lipstick ( Mom again ).
    As to the issue of small talk, do you have any hobbies/interests/favorite movies/tv shows? You can chatter away about utter silliness that is trivial and not revealing any of your personal business. For those of you who have a hard time with this concept start watching women in your vicinity who have the technique mastered. Observation is a powerful learning tool.
    I present myself to the world in a very deliberate fashion because I know that when people interact with me I am representing ALL black women, and I want the person i’m interacting with to leave with a positive impression of me and indirectly of all bw. I am dark skinned, I wear my hair naturally ( did you guess by my name lol) and I feel that I am a walking billboard to combat the negative images being shoved down everyone’s throats about bw. We all should operate from this mindset because one of the ways to negate negative images is to become the walking talking breathing HD/3D version of positive, beautiful, attractive bw. Just my 2 cents.

  11. Evia says:

    Also, I’ve read in a lot of places that you don’t want to bring up heavy topics with men you are interested in too soon. I kinda get why but then I think how deeply do you get involved with a man before you start bring up subjects that could be deal-breakers such as, whether or not to have children, how to raise children, where you will live, whether to have one parent stay at home, etc?

    I don’t remember exactly where I address these specific questions but I’m sure I must have covered them somewhere. 🙂 However, a lot depends on whether you’re seriously on the marriage track or not. If you’re on the marriage track, you want to be sure that he’s also open to marriage IF all goes well in the relationship. Never assume. You also don’t need to waste each others’ time.

    When I was on the marriage track with Darren, I casually checked, maybe on the second date, to find out whether Darren felt the same way about marriage. He said, “of course.” Naturally, everything depended on whether we clicked in the relationship.

    Some men absolutely don’t see marriage in their future. That’s a man’s perogative, but if you’re on the marriage track (meaning you want to get married in the next 1-1/2 to 2 years), then you should not go out with a man who tells you he’s not open to marriage or even one who can’t see marriage in the near future. That’s a serious red flag. I mean, I would wonder why does he want to date me or spend time with me if he can’t see himself married to me?????

    MOST men will hedge on the marriage question or say they’re open to marriage since they want to have sex with you. This is why I advocate that women should let a man know upfront that she is seeking a serious relationship and therefore sex is on the back burner since it takes a lot more than sex to have a satisfying committed relationship. If you’re on the marriage track, the purpose of spending time with a manis NOT to have sex but to get to know each other to determine whether you’re compatible with each other for MARRIAGE. A woman should nicely express to a man “After all, there will be plenty of time for sex later on in our relationship IF we decide to get married.”

    Not saying that every woman MUST be married before sex, but marriage should be kept on the front burner if she’s on the marriage track. The woman must make sure of this–not by nagging, but by steering and making sure that he’s buying into your future together. A man will SHOW that he’s buying into a future with you by DOING certain things.

    When a man is dating you with a serious eye towards marriage, he will wait for intercourse, and if he can’t wait, that tells you something about him that you need to know. Besides, a couple can be creative. Other sexual stuff (outercourse) is fine, IMO. Personally speaking, if a man is in a serious relationship with me prior to marriage and we’re not having sex–and he goes and has sex with another woman for a release, that wouldn’t bother me much because she’s not getting anything if I have his heart. A man’s HEART is HIM. LOL! So I want his HEART.

    I’m defining sex as intercourse here because that is what usually ruins a good chance at a strong relationship by totally blinding or interfering with a man and woman getting to know each other’s mind, heart, and CHARACTER. MANY women “marry” a man when she has intercourse with him whereas to many men, it’s just a release, unless he already cares about the woman. Sex usually blinds a lot of people. They get married without even knowing each other or the relationship crashes without them even knowing who they were in a relationship with.

    Even men are saying these days that women should not have sex with men early in a relationship.

    If a woman doesn’t want children, she definitely should let a man know very early. I think the other questions you asked are areas that can easily be negotiated. I do remember discussing at length in the vetting men newsletter the issue of money which relates to one parent staying at home with the children.

    There are no guarantees, no matter what, but I think that a woman should ALWAYS play her cards close to her chest so that she’s not emotionally wounded or left holding some other bag.

    • Hodan says:

      great post as usual, I have a question thou:

      you said: “if a man is in a serious relationship with me prior to marriage and we’re not having sex–and he goes and has sex with another woman for a release, that wouldn’t bother me much because she’s not getting anything if I have his heart. A man’s HEART is HIM”

      Hodan: doesn’t that sound like ‘ he might be with you now,’ but ‘he comes home to me’ usual tap and dance that does not serve women? If I’m in a committed relationship with a man, where we plan to marry one day….and he goes out there to sex some woman (as if though he is the only one suffering from lack of sex), then it tells me a lot about his character. Sex to me is both spiritual and physical pleasure/union, so I guess it depends on a person’s perspective.

      • joyousnerd says:

        *Warning: LONG post!*
        Hodan, I share your misgivings about Evia’s post. Though I respect Evia very much and enjoy her blog, this concept of tolerating sexual infidelity does not sit well with me.

        If a man is in a serious relationship with me, he needs to be faithful to me. That’s a baseline, like being gainfully employed, sober and sane.

        If he goes to another woman for release before the marriage, he will do so after the marriage. He will feel that since he got away with it earlier, he can get away with it later. This idea that since he’s not getting it from his wife, it’s ok to get it somewhere else… it’s just not wise.

        What happens when a woman is heavily pregnant and finds sex uncomfortable? Or when she is up around the clock with a newborn? I don’t want a man who would feel entitled to “play outside” during that time, or ever. Once it’s seen as ok to do under some circumstances, most men will tie themselves in a knot to convince themselves that it is ok in many different circumstances. I would not tolerate a man stepping out on me.

        Frankly this sounds much like the way that BW stay in nonreciprocal relationships with DBR men. They excuse his cheating, while he would NEVER tolerate them cheating on HIM for sexual release!

        While I’m here, I just wanted to say another word about “playing outside”. I dearly hope that no BW reading this blog are thinking that since some argue its okay for men to cheat, that it’s ok for women to begin relationships with married (or otherwise taken) men. Volunteering to be a side piece of a** is degrading, foolish and detrimental to a woman’s health, sanity and marriage prospects.

        What happens when you sleep with a married man? You cheapen yourself in his eyes because he doesn’t even have to give the ILLUSION of fidelity! He sees you as cheap, easy and of low morals.

        What do other quality men think of you when they find out you were a married man’s side piece of a**? And the news is likely to get out. They think you are cheap, easy and of low morals: not marriage quality.

        What happens to women in these “relationships”? Often they get strung along for YEARS as a side piece… wasting their precious youth on a man who belongs to someone else.

        OOW kids can be borne of these unions in an “accident” meant to force him to divorce his wife. When this works, you’ve won quite a prize; a cheater! Usually it fails, though.

        Honestly it’s hard enough to find a good husband when you have children, but the OOW fruit of an affair is not the most desirable thing to bring to a relationship. Many quality men would pass right over that woman.

        And good luck getting a married man to raise the fruit of his affair. Most of the time he will fight to keep every penny, and he won’t spend time with the child, unless it’s a pretext to getting more illicit sex from the foolish side piece.

        Plus a side piece runs the risk of the wife or her relatives beating her up, trashing her home, or merely telling the world the truth about her unsavory nature. Drama is inescapable in this kind of situation.

        Letting a man step out on you and creeping with married men are two things that are antithetical to living well, in my humble opinion.

        To me these are common sense, but there are many foolish women out there being the “girlfriend” like it’s cute. SMDH. I’m lucky my mother raised me to know not to sully myself in this manner, but not everyone was that lucky. A girl once shared on a forum that her mother was a jumpoff, her grandmother was a jumpoff AND even her great-grandmother was a jumpoff!!!

        Even if you come from 3 generations of jumpoffs, you can still choose better for yourself. You don’t have to live like that!

        And, likewise, even if you see other women tolerating infidelity, that doesn’t mean you have to do it. You can always choose quality for yourself.

  12. Nicole says:

    Butterfly here,

    What do we talk about? I often compliment a lively color that a person is wearing, point out anything unique from shoes to books to hairstyles, mention something about the surroundings that we are in, bring up a factoid or whatnot about the event/place, speak of the sunshine or the breeze—-many things that are neutral, of nature, non-threatening, simply light and positive.

    It’s so fun and butterfly-ish to keep a bit of mystique, to speak as one friend pointed out to me just last week, “enigmatically”, to leave more to the imagination about your inner self than is seen or spoken. Butterflies leave you wishing that they’d stuck around just a bit longer. I’ve had the pleasure of a butterfly landing on my shoulder or leg, and thought, “, Wow, I’m so special, she landed on ME!!!”

    We often have to deal with those who are mad at us for being “so happy all the time”, but in reality they are admiring the butterflies that we are and wishing that they had the strength to let themselves fly.

  13. HR Professional says:

    Hi All,
    I have to thank my Mother for her telling us not to let other people know what is going on in our lives, past or present. To be honest, I think whoever came up with that Vegas campaign owes my Mother some type of compensation. She had been saying that catchphrase as long as I can remember.

    The principles Evia and Khadija are teaching about are Sociological principles that were studied by the late Sociologist Erving Goffman. Goffman’s book entitled The Presentation of Self in Everyday Life, laid out the belief that everyone upon meeting new people or entering a new environment wore a mask. The use of this mask was to only show oneself in a different light. The mask allows the user to present controlled images to the outside while voluntarily holding back things that might be conceived as negative or not needing to be displayed. Goffman metaphorically compared this practice to a theatrical production. Whereas, the actor gives an amazing performance, without giving away what is going on backstage. The audience is not given a tour of the backstage until they are welcomed into the actor’s inner circle.

    I think most BW liked the whole keeping it real tomfoolery because so many of us have been damaged by horrible things in our lives. The unfortunate circumstance of childhood sexual abuse should be handled by a professional, not by people you eat lunch with. We believe everyone is our personal psychiatrist and wants to listen to everything we say. Some women don’t understand that verbally assaulting others who are too polite to walk away, is the quickest way to lose friends and alienate acquaintances. Yes, true friends are there to help you over the hurdle, and sometimes over a mountain, but not for the entire friendship. No one wants to be around a Negative Nellie forever. It is quite sad that our telling everything is another chunk of negative PR we have to withstand. To let that mask slip, as it has done for the past 50 or so years, has proven to be catastrophic for BW.

    • >>We believe everyone is our personal psychiatrist and wants to listen to everything we say. Some women don’t understand that verbally assaulting others who are too polite to walk away, is the quickest way to lose friends and alienate acquaintances.

      I cannot wait for Oprah to go to cable. She’s been a massive influence in turning the culture into one of TMI. You are so on the money for calling it verbal assault. I’ve been an unwilling recipient of these victim horror stories, and I hardly knew the person.

      I’ve had my “Wow, you are nice” or “You are always smiling” comments from surprised white people. It makes me laugh. We all have that wonderful “mean mad angry black woman” rep, before we even speak.

      Health Care has to start implementing mental health checkups with the physical as part of a holistic approach. There are too many undiagnosed and hurting people out there.

  14. Felicia says:

    I know I’m beating a dead horse (LOL), but black women seriously need to stop acting like soldiers. Being a solider is a MAN’S job. Since most (not all but IMO most) BM don’t know how to/refuse to solider like other men from functioning and thriving cultures, this “community” talk is a moot point. It’s nonsense and a waste of time. So it’s best to let it go.

    The only way BW are going to sprout those butterfly wings, relax, open up, and smile more is if they STOP this useless solider/warrior schtick. IMO t’s not only a bad look, but also incompatible with the feminine behaviors (like smiling for instance) that will attract a quality man and future husband from the global village.

    Check out the results from this study regarding smiling below…

    WOMEN SMILE MORE THAN MEN, EXCEPT WHEN THEY ARE IN SIMILAR ROLES

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2003/03/030319080920.htm

    Women do smile more than men, but when occupying similar work and social roles, the gender differences in the rate of smiling disappear, a Yale researcher has found.

    Also, there are large differences in the degree to which men smile less than women depending on a person’s culture, ethnicity, age, or when people think they are being observed, according to the study funded by the National Science Foundation.

    “It would be interesting for social psychologists and anthropologists to look at these data because the wide cultural, ethnic and other differences suggest that the sex difference is not something that is hard-wired,” said Marianne LaFrance, professor of psychology at Yale and senior author of the study published this month in the journal Psychological Bulletin. “This is not a function of being male or female. Each culture overlays men and women with rules about appropriate behavior for men and women.”

    LaFrance and her co-authors, Elizabeth Paluck of Yale and Marvin Hecht, a graduate student at the time, set out to examine every available study that has been done on sex differences in smiling. Ultimately, they looked at 186 research reports.

    They found that women do smile more than men, but the difference is modest. “The difference is there, but it’s not whopping,” LaFrance said. “Indeed, there are studies that find just the opposite.”
    Also, the rate at which men and women differ in how much they smile is greater in the United States and Canada than in other parts of the world, like England and Australia. In the United States, there is a greater sex difference among Caucasians in smiling, but this difference virtually disappears among African-Americans.

    In terms of age differences, teens show the largest sex difference in smiling. After that, the sexes converge on their smile rates. “We don’t know why it maxes out among young adults,” LaFrance said. “One possibility is that that is the age when the sexes are supposed to be maximally different from each other, for procreation or social purposes. After that, it’s not so important.”
    The researchers also found that the largest sex differences in smiling occurred when men and women thought they were being observed. They smiled more similarly when they thought no one was looking.

    “The logic here is when people know their behavior is being monitored, they more closely adhere to the norms for appropriate behavior for their gender,” LaFrance said. “People are at their gendered best when people are looking.”

    Men and women also smile about the same amount when they are in the same position in terms of power, occupation or social role. Here, LaFrance surmises that the sex differences are overridden by smile norms for the role one is in, rather than with the sex one is.

    However, when there is tension in the air, women more often than men try to diffuse it with a smile. “Women do what we call ’emotion work’ and one of the best ways to do this is to smile to soothe hurt feelings, to restore harmony,” LaFrance said.

  15. Truth P. says:

    The situation I can think of with me “laying all my cards out on the table” was when I was in a very hostile environment.

    What I did was foolishly done as a survival tactic.I was only a teen and was suddenly in a very racist environment surrounded around racist white women.I put alot of information about myself out there because I was one of only two black people where I worked and was looked at with great suspicion by some racist white women.My giving up TMI was my way of saying “Please don’t give me a hard time,I promise i’m not like those other black people”.
    Although at the time I didn’t realize exactly what was happening and why I was reacting the way I did.Being a teen at the time,19 to be exact,I had never run into white women who held such racist anti black beliefs.It was shocking to me.I really do believe that I like many other black women had been told so many bad things in regards to racism about white men but white women had somehow been completely absolved of any wrong doing.Therefore,I never suspected that I was being treated bad by those women due to my race until a young white girl,also about 19 or 20,told a racist joke right to my face.It was the first time I had witnessed or
    experienced any kind of racist behavior or speech from a white person.

    My laying all my cards on the table,being “open and honest”, had the unintended effect of these women letting me know alot of their personal information.Upon learning about their whore ways and that many of them were oow mothers depending on the government I felt really bad that I had went out of my way to prove my worthiness to them.I also felt bad that I had in some way thrown other black people under the bus by basically saying “I’m not like them” just not in those words.It is something that I regret every single day.That and the racism I endured daily still makes me want to cry.The only reason I survived any of it,and I survived it for years, was because some of the white MEN I worked with put a stop to it.It was defitnetly a situation that I know my FEMININE/WOMAN CARD came in handy.

    • ARLYNE says:

      Do not beat yourself up. You had a great learning experience. You now know you can encounter racism and survive. You also did a good thing in letting the WM protect you. I think that BW, besides looking for marriage outside, should also look for protection from outside. BM will not protect us. I think it is smart to enjoy this benefit of a patriarchal society.

      WW are, usually, not perceived as racist because they do not fight their own battles and WM protect them. WW will threaten, cajole, and goad WM into doing the dirty work of racism. She sits back smiling and acting nice while the WM does the heavy lifting. This pertains to this subject because WW do not let the world see that they are racist. Whereas, the BW lets the world see her fighting. The BW shows the world that she despises and has contempt for WM (non-BM). The BW lets the world know that seeing BM with WW (non-BW) upsets her.

      I feel this behavior weakens the BW. It lets others know what buttons to push. I have observed that when the media wants to boost ratings, they pick on BW. They bring up BM/WW relationships. They will exploit a “racial incident” involving a BM so the foolish mules will run to his defense. They know they can count on a high degree of emotionality which makes good entertainment.

      • IRockIRoll says:

        I just wanted to say that you are absolutely right concerning the media. For the past year, when the topic concerned a social piece, the comments were usually closed on the New York Times website… unless black women were in any way mentioned. Then it was open season, with little moderation in the comments. Have I mentioned that it has been a year since I PAID for the New York Times? And yep, I used to be a subscriber. Ladies, this is because the MSM is WELL aware that we don’t really have any public defenders for our collective.

        For Truth P. and to those in a similar situation of a hostile environment… I’d say the worst thing to be is apologetic towards your abusers. If you feel attacked, and there is no way out there is no need to be the Angry Black Woman, or let them see you sweat. A level stare, and a simple declarative statement can usually alleviate the immediate situation.

  16. Truth P. says:

    My mother who was a married woman never gave up too much info about herself.She did NOT participate in alot of therapy talk or gossip like so many of the other older women I knew.
    I know my mother spilled the beans to my dad waaaayy more than she did to her friends over the phone.We had a phone but my mom rarily was on it.It’s good to have friends that you can talk too but sometimes they get tired of playing psychiatrist as HR has said.

    I always thought to myself that alot of black women blab openly because they have no place where they can do it in private.I always felt that so many black women gossiped because they did not have a life.My mom was friends with a bunch of gossipers she grew up with and knew as a child but my mom didn’t gossip all the time like them.My dad took my mother out on dates.They had good times together.My mom had a full life unlike the women who were getting into drama because of gossip.I know that some of those women sat on the phone talking to eachother all night and exhausted righteous things to talk about so they made things up just to have something to say because they had nothing to do.
    I know because they were my babysitters sometimes when my parents went out.

  17. Lorie says:

    The “keep it real” thing is very embarrassing to watch in upscale environments. I debuted with a group of young women at an international ball. Lately, we have begun to socialize together. Less than a handful of us are black. One of us (BW) behaves in a very unlady-like manner. She is cruel and crude. She broadcasts her sexual encounters (including her unfortunate partners’ dysfunctions), raids the “hors d’oeuvre platters, brags about material things and name drops… WM who know her game seem to fear her. However, the WW can’t get enough of her. I finally get it. Outside of the ghetto, BW like this are clowns, providing those who don’t “keep it real” with entertainment. Besides, I think it gives WW an ego boost. I bet they wish I would follow suit and be less of the butterfly I am…

  18. Hodan says:

    Another useful and informative post Khadija. I always assume these tips and advices are common sense or something our mothers have taught us, but it seems not to be the case from my interaction with women @ work and in social settings. Knowing your boundaries and keeping your ‘real you’ for those who earned your trust and definitely outside of work setting is key to succeeding in our world. Its a policy many other cultures know and practice, but seems to be lacking within our communities. As the saying goes, ‘you catch more flies with honey than vinegar’.

    revolutionary and joyful: “For example, if I am in a conversation with a small to large group of people I generally don’t speak unless I think I have something of import to say. Which often means that when I do speak it’s about something I care / am passionate about I know I can come across as aggressive.”

    Hodan: I think it depends on the environment you happen to be @. I’m of the perspective that in the work environment or formal social settings, NEVER ever bring politics, religion or personal issue. If someone says something offensive or annoys you, judge it if its worth ignoring (most often it is), if not then you can always say with neutral voice and if possible with humor your point of view. You can be passionate about something and still maintain the illusion of balance and fairness. In most white setting/environment, we forget its about avoiding controversial things, so follow their example.

    revolutionary and joyful: “Any books, resources, etc that give concrete advice in that area would be great.”

    Hodan: these are great books about social etiquette and settings…and much more:

    1. How to Win Friends & Influence People by Dale Carnegie
    2. The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen R. Covey

  19. Evia says:

    BW like this are clowns, providing those who don’t “keep it real” with entertainment.

    ITA. Black clowns are very entertaining to whites. They provide comic relief. Historically, blacks had the role of the entertainers and they still mostly do. The traditional roles of blacks have NOT changed much at all because many blacks STILL cooperate and voluntarily perform those roles and with gusto.

    I think that a lot of blacks need to understand precisely what those roles were and the scripts for those roles. These blacks believe that any black person who does not perform the role (or doesn’t ‘keep it real’ and etc.) is acting white or bougie. This is because they believe that those roles are the natural/authentic behavior of a ‘real’ black person whereas those are ROLES that their ancestors were “trained” to perform and the roles were passed down. The ‘keepin’ it real’ role for a present-day AA woman is simply a variation of the ain’t-scared-of-nothing, sharp-tongued SAPPHIRE from the plantation. A lot of people, including many black folks EXPECT for a bw to behave like a Sapphire and “tell folks off” at the drop of a hat. How many times have we heard an AA woman PROUDLY say that she told somebody off? How many times have we heard a ww or a woman from any other race or ethnic group proudly say that she told someone off? Not many, if any.

    Clowning/cooning is also one of those roles.

    Trust me. Whites have been socialized to be very comfortable with blacks performing those roles. Typical whites often become uncomfortable when blacks behave outside of those traditional roles. For ex., SOME whites think a black person is angry when a bw doesn’t behave like a jolly ‘Aunt Jemima’ or when a bm doesn’t behave like an ‘Amos and Andy’ or ‘Stepin Fetchit’ coon/buffoon.

    I encourage bw to behave like genteel, lighthearted, pleasant/charming butterflies, but this does NOT mean that they should ever be clowns. People laugh AT clowns and don’t generally think of respecting them or of them having any value outside of being entertaining clowns.

    For ex., many white male youth flocked to outrageous images and behavior of AA male Hip Hoppers, bought the music (?) and listened to a lot of Hip Hop. Many blacks who are hungry for acceptance by whites believed that they were “converting” these white males to the ‘black side’ or that the bulk of those white males were embracing and accepting them when actually the bulk of these white youth were rebelling, amusing themselves or trying on amusing costumes/personas. I mean, do these white youth–many of whom are now grown–ever protect/defend/support bm? No–not for long or certainly not more than a relative few. This is just like the Hippies movement of the 1960s & 70s all over again, but bm were easily fooled by wm buying Hip Hop because they want wm’s acceptance so badly.

    In our ‘George Bush’ conservative, overwhelmingly white community, Darren’s nephews listened to HIP HOP a lot too when they were teens and for a while in college. However, they took off those costumes, went on from high school straight into college to get graduate degrees in math, science, computers, get married at young ages, buy homes etc. However, for many black youth, Hip Hop became their permanent outfit. The difference is caused by the fact that for Darren’s nephews, there’s a much larger real life for them outside of Hip Hop. That’s where they now live ‘for real,’ with their wives and children, whereas so many of their black males peers chose to ‘keep it real’ still devoting the bulk of their time and energy to living in a Hip Hop fantasy land.

    • Zoopath says:

      Yes, “hip hop” is another example of how we just don’t get it. White people for the most part can consume hip hop and not poison their minds. AA’s internalize the toxic messages much more, to our great detriment. I’ve actually gotten into discussions with upper middle class AA’s about how I don’t think it’s appropriate for children to hear music such as “Stanky leg”. I’ve been told that they’re going to pick it up no matter what I do (to which I silently thought, you don’t know the depths of my OCD 🙂 I refuse to accept that, if they don’t care to try then that’s their choice but I’m not permitting our future children to be exposed to underclass culture.

      • Sharifa says:

        I agree with both of you. Only AA’s take things to heart in this way. WP engage in these things and then move on to real life, AA’s elevate these things to cultures, lifestyles and whole identities. WP generally don’t engage in another group’s practices to their detriment. I see certain musical forms as legitimate parts of our culture (e.g. jazz), but I don’t see jazz as my identity the way people view hip-hop.

  20. Evia says:

    @Hodan re:

    you (Evia) said: “if a man is in a serious relationship with me prior to marriage and we’re not having sex–and he goes and has sex with another woman for a release, that wouldn’t bother me much because she’s not getting anything if I have his heart. A man’s HEART is HIM”

    Hodan: doesn’t that sound like ‘ he might be with you now,’ but ‘he comes home to me’ usual tap and dance that does not serve women? If I’m in a committed relationship with a man, where we plan to marry one day….and he goes out there to sex some woman (as if though he is the only one suffering from lack of sex), then it tells me a lot about his character. Sex to me is both spiritual and physical pleasure/union, so I guess it depends on a person’s perspective.

    Hodan, a woman rarely ever knows whether a man is actually being faithful to her. We’ve seen this over and over, yet so many women keep opening their legs thinking that if they give it to him, he won’t go looking for it elsewhere. This is NOT true. I personally don’t worry about something or try to fix it when I don’t know it’s broken. Instead, I focus on what I know will pay off bigtime: winning his heart.

    I know that’s MUCH more effective at keeping him faithful and a woman is treated special every day if she sits squarely in the middle of a man’s heart. He is willing to do a lot to keep from losing her, including being faithful.

    So I think a lot of women put way too much emphasis on trying to keep a man’s genitals faithful without trying to win his heart. This is WHY a lot of women will OFFER a man sex early in the relationship–to try her best to keep his genitals faithful to her. And MOST men know this and this is why they use her fear to threaten to get sex from other women if YOU don’t give it up. That would never work with me. Besides, I know that if I can get his HEART, I’ve got 99.9999% of him anyway. I don’t believe that you win a man’s heart by GIVING and DOING for him. He may appreciate that but instead, a typical MAN wants to give and do for a woman.

    That’s what I meant. I didn’t mean that I’m going to overlook a man playing around prior to marriage. If that occurred, I would know I didn’t have his heart, consider it a loss and move on. I should have explained it more precisely.

    Of course, you have to be dealing with a man who knows that you’re valuable. This is why I like brainy men. A brainier man understands the value of quality and therefore a Quality woman much moreso than a dimwit. But if we look at someone like Bill Clinton, a brainy man, and Hillary, I don’t believe that Hillary ever had his heart. I think that they were two very high achievers who had an “understanding” that went beserk when his political enemies used that to beat him down.

    Let me point out that it’s only relatively recently with the advent of “romantic” love that Western women have tried to require men to be faithful. If you read history, among UPPER class Europeans and American (whites), many men and women “played outside” and still do. Many upper class European men and women definitely had their “consorts.” And what do you think happens in those geisha houses with Japanese men before and after marriage? That’s an institution there that the women accept as long as the man is fulfilling his role. Also among Africans, the “girlfriend” is an institution in most African cultures and among Arabs. Probably Indian men too. Not saying everybody does it, but it IS fairly common.

    However, maybe this is just way too much realism for some of you. LOL! This is why I aim for a man’s heart. I aim to be his friend, lover, playmate, confidante, soul mate, partner, etc. because if a woman can achieve this to any good extent, she doesn’t have to worry about much else.

    • {temporarily entering the conversation}

      Evia,

      Let me supplement your “reality check” view with some additional reality-check-based observations from representing thousands of men over the years.

      The odds of a man’s faithfulness are increased when the woman has achieved a combination of these 3 factors. Each factor builds on the preceeding one:

      Factor#1: The man places HIGH value on her and on keeping her in his life. Evia, I believe this is what you’re talking about when you say, “This is why I aim for a man’s heart. I aim to be his friend, lover, playmate, confidante, soul mate, partner, etc. because if a woman can achieve this to any good extent, she doesn’t have to worry about much else.”

      Where AA women often mess up is that they settle for men who are basically indifferent toward them, and therefore who don’t place much value on them or on keeping them in their lives. The first major clue is when a man doesn’t offer marriage. If he values a woman and wants to keep her affection exclusive to him, then he’ll want to marry her. [Even if one of his major motives is simply about taking the woman off the dating/sex market because he wants her all to himself.] Baby mamas and women who shack and play house instead of being offered marriage are not valued by men.

      What I’ve always found fascinating about the men I’ve represented is the overall different levels of respect expressed toward their wives versus their baby mamas.

      Most men I’ve observed, even when they hate their soon-to-be-ex-wife’s guts with a passion, STILL—unconsciously, without intending to do so—speak more respectfully of their wives than they ever do about side pieces and baby mamas.* Men hold side pieces and baby mamas in absolute contempt. [*There’s a distinction between the attitude of “I hate her a** because she did X, Y, and Z” versus “She ain’t sh*t, and never was.”]

      Factor#2: The man knows that the woman will most likely divorce and otherwise dump him if she ever finds out that he’s been unfaithful. Where AA women often mess up is that they come to the relationship being visibly needy and desperate. Even worse, many AA women openly make statements that indicate that they’ll tolerate being cheated on. Worst of all, marrying a man who has been disrespectful enough to have been openly cheating on the woman.

      Factor#3: The woman has not let herself go; she’s kept herself “flawless;” and so the man KNOWS that if she dumps him, she can fairly easily replace him with another comparable, and maybe a superior man. This is one of several angles that I was trying to get across during the “Flawless” post at the previous blog. The real deal is that women’s romantic options decrease as they get older, while a reasonably successful man’s options stay more or less the same. Quiet as its kept, wives who let themselves go physically lose market share and leverage in their man’s heart.

      Men are territorial. A lot of men are okay with being dumped by their wives for cheating if they feel confident that the wife won’t be able to replace them. What men don’t like is the thought that they will be replaced by the woman without missing a beat. And so, they’re less likely to risk that with a woman who can and WILL quickly move on and get another comparable man.

      But each factor is premised on the one(s) that came before it. A beautiful, smokin’-hot woman (insert the names of several extremely good-looking Black actresses) who fails to adhere to Factors 1 #2 will be cheated on as frequently as an unattractive woman who started off with fewer romantic options.

      {going back into radio silence}

      Expect Success!

      • Neecy says:

        Khadija,

        You and Evia are such great target shooters when it comes to this. i certainly appreciate this post re: men, how they value women etc. Too many AA women in this generation have simply lost touch of the balance between men and women and never received such advice. Now when one tries to school them (NWNW) or encourage them to change their behaviors for the better, they are so caught in the Blk Comm warped reality they actually think this whole Baby Momma mess is nothing to blink at.

        Based on the responses from NWNW, its clear that a many Black women simply can’t understand what it is to be valued or how to go about making sure she is valued as a woman.

        its so sad. i am so greatful the Good Lord above made me one of the AA women with common sense.

      • Hodan says:

        lol, yep. Beauty and sexual availability never kept a man around without few effective factors playing in….aka what you listed.

    • Hodan says:

      Thanks for elaborating on it and I agree monogamy is very much a modern phenomenon, even with the rise of religion and its intend to regulate human sexuality.

  21. RColeman says:

    …I finally get it. Outside of the ghetto, BW like this are clowns, providing those who don’t “keep it real” with entertainment. Besides, I think it gives WW an ego boost. I bet they wish I would follow suit and be less of the butterfly I am…

    Yes…and those WW who have spent time in those environments expect you to continue to emulate those they encountered.

    Case in point that comes to mind-

    A few months ago while working at my local co-op a man came into the store. To me he seemed “off” so I kept my distance and in my range of observation.

    He just so happened to see one of my co-worker’s hat lying on one of the picnic tables. He took it and wore it out of the co-op. I then told another co-worker what he did. Now this was a WW mind you, who spent time teaching dance in Philadelphia…which makes her think she is in with the ABCs…acting black crew.

    I kid you not…this is what transpired.

    Her; “you did not stop him?!”
    Me; “Nope.”
    Her; “Well I’m going to get that hat back…I’s keeping it real..I’m protecting my peeps!”

    Not only did she run down the street and got the hat back, but she then told the rest of the staff what had transpired between us.

    The manager told her that the dude seemed “off”. In other words, it was not worth what she did.

    Come to find out that he is a psych patient…and that considering that it could have ended quite badly for her.

    All in the name of “keeping it real.”

    • HR Professional says:

      Even though the psych patient did wrong and she was even “wronger” LOL for following behind him. Had anything happened to the silly woman, it would have been wall-to-wall coverage on how an innocent woman was attacked by a crazed psych patient. She would have been called a hero because she protected the property of a fellow co-worker. She would have been held up as a younger version of the “pistol packing granny”. How silly of her to follow behind and demand that she be given back the hat. When WW do things like that, they have an entitled personality. They feel as if no harm will ever befall them. For the most part they are right. Should anything have happened to Beckynesha, LOL they would have the entire police force looking for him.

  22. Karen R. says:

    The “keeping it real” slogan can be translated into “keeping it ‘ignant.”
    I think about self-disclosure as an issue of boundaries. Just like you don’t let a guest venture throughout your home, friends, co-workers, etc. should only have access to you to the degree that is commensurate to your level of relationship. Some friends/acquaintances (sp?) you only greet on your front porch. They don’t get to come inside. While other friends may have access to your personal sitting room or library, where deeper conversations take place and more disclosure is allowed. Then your “holiest of holy” place figuratively is your bedroom where full disclosure takes place.

    A very good book is Boundaries by Henry Cloud and John Townsend. They have also written a book called “Boundaries in Dating” as well as “Boundaries in Marriage.” Another book by Henry Cloud is “Safe People.” Very helpful in terms of how to recognize people who are safe and those who are not.

    • Zoopath says:

      OMG, I loooooooooove The Boundaries books. Oh, they are so amazong. I have it on my Kindle but I’m considering buying physical copies for some family members.

  23. squarlymade says:

    Yes, I live in a white environment. some people really PRESS. As in invite you over for dinner and ask 21 questions! It’s usually in the situation of a gathering where you can’t just say ‘oh, gotta go’. I’ve learned how to flutter and keep things moving on the phone, like when someone calls and says ‘what are you doing?’ I’ll just say ‘why, what’s going on’ and then let them talk and say what, when, why and then I will answer whether or not it works. If it’s in a setting of a multigenerational white environments it’s very unusual to not answer questions, and the questions are usually asked because that’s what they want to know, so they seem to keep going back to the question. With peers it’s different, but I think it’s when it’s in the multigenerational setting that gets tricky. There seems to be many things getting tacked onto knowing how to be a butterfly, ‘keeping it real, letting it all hang out, not smiling, soldering, and acting unattractive. If I could just extract the finer art of being a butterfly, that is the info I still need. I’m quiet, graceful, and calm, I don’t have a potty month but…people do press for information. What do you do for instance when someone comes up at a barbecue ( older women who you want to respect) and says cute jeans what kind are they, and then goes behind you to look at the tag! I can get out of the ‘how much are you paying for the lawn care?’ question, I just say oh, let me get you his name and number. Sometimes people really just stump you with a shocking question, and their telling all kinds of stuff as well, but I still feel uncomfortable with what they are asking. I think these people just consider it banter, but for me I want to conserve some info. I would usually just come out and say, I don’t feel comfortable with that question, but that got some anger stirred. Any one have any examples of how to talk without talking…say like when you are PRESSED for info. I know when people are crossing the boundary, but how do I do the dodge dance. And even, I don’t really even want them knowing that I think their question is intrusive.

    • Oshun/Aphrodite says:

      I have had the “pressed” experience as well. And I am not understanding how people think this is ok or normal- no matter the age. I just ignore (I wish I could have more finesse with this) and if they get angry then that is their anger. Which usually means there is something that ain’t no good behind the line of questioning anyway.

      I think people are trying to mine for the set up. Maybe I am paranoid, but that is what I feel when people are pressing for info that is none of their business. They are trying to calculate (the way you think, the way you behave – something) to gain some kind of advantage. So let them be mad.

      Bc honestly I am angry that someone who I don’t know from Adam’s house cat is asking me something crazy personal. Especially when it comes to money questions and love life questions. Becky’s be relentless when it comes to mining folks for info. I start having Kizzy flashbacks when someone nonblack is tying to force me to tell them something.

      I had one WW neighbor ask me when I was walking home – what was I using my garage for? I lie to you not. Seems simple, but I was annoyed. I didn’t have a car at the time and I am like how random – especially since I have never exchanged anything but hi and bye with her?

      Instead of her being normal and exchanging pleasantries and asking for a favor “I don’t know you very well, but would you mind if?” – which is what she wanted anyway and I would have promptly said no because I was using it for storage and I didn’t know her like that…

      But instead she had to be extra and ask me something like what are you using your garage for?

      As if she could calculate in her head based on what I would say and wheedle her way into getting whatever it was she wanted.

      I am over folks like that…

      • ak says:

        Oshun/Aphrodite:

        I think people are trying to mine for the set up. Maybe I am paranoid, but that is what I feel when people are pressing for info that is none of their business. They are trying to calculate (the way you think, the way you behave – something) to gain some kind of advantage. So let them be mad.

        Yes, yes, and yes and this is why I’ve had regrets in the past why now I see and hear these people probing, or pressing, and I really do not like the people who do that and after all that probing I’ll never like that person.

        Like I said above, I cannot stand the ones who ask the same question a few minutes later, hours later, or even weeks later, and they will too, you know. Don’t put it past them Oshun.

    • Oshun/Aphrodite says:

      “What do you do for instance when someone comes up at a barbecue ( older women who you want to respect) and says cute jeans what kind are they, and then goes behind you to look at the tag!”

      Thats really familiar. I would not be ok with someone touching me. Either they don’t see you as an adult or they are assuming some serious familiarities because you are a BW.

      “and their telling all kinds of stuff as well”

      Trust. I have waay to many WW abortion – married WW I screwed my tour guide in Greece/Cancun/Egypt behind my husband’s back stories than I care for.

      “And even, I don’t really even want them knowing that I think their question is intrusive.”

      I don’t know how this can be avoided unless you play it off as a joke and remove yourself from the person thats asking the question.

      • ak says:

        Oshun/Aphrodite:

        Thats really familiar. I would not be ok with someone touching me. Either they don’t see you as an adult or they are assuming some serious familiarities because you are a BW.

        Oh my dear! What would most black people out there do with their time if they weren’t acting too familiar with other black people that they don’t know, or don’t know well? They need boundaries, I’m telling you, and how to respect them.

        This isn’t like slavery anymore when blacks weren’t allowed to have boundaries of their own, other people including otherslaves could do whatever to you, and all the slaves were just thrown together without regard for personal space, the person, or property.

        But try telling black people that these days.

    • Evia says:

      If I could just extract the finer art of being a butterfly, that is the info I still need.

      I understand but honestly this cannot be adequately conveyed on a blog. This is dynamic process-learning. It takes time and observing it is necessary to an extent. It’s not a step 1, step 2, step 3 type learning because much has to do with what the other person in the situation is doing.

      Ladies This is what I mean when I say repeatedly that AA women need a RUCOSS because an uplifting culture of some sort conveys at least the basics of how individuals can successfully address many of their various challenges and needs: social skills, emotional, sexual, educational, marital, child-rearing, physical, spiritual, and their myriad other needs.

      I’m quiet, graceful, and calm, I don’t have a potty month but…people do press for information. What do you do for instance when someone comes up at a barbecue ( older women who you want to respect) and says cute jeans what kind are they, and then goes behind you to look at the tag!

      IMO, this falls under social skills. In a RUCOSS, a child/young person receives an adequate amount of social skills training over a number of years that provides them the skills to aid them in a wide variety of social situations. In other words, they receive a social skills REPERTOIRE. IMO, this particular situation that you’ve described has nothing to do with being a black woman. Your discomfort is personality driven. If someone were peeking at the tag on my jeans, I wouldn’t think it’s because I’m black and I wouldn’t care. I’d figure they must like the way the jeans look on me. But you seem to be uncomfortable with people showing a certain amount of interest in you. This may be because you are shy to that extent. However, people ARE going to show interest in anyone who’s among them and this is NORMAL.

      I can get out of the ‘how much are you paying for the lawn care?’ question, I just say oh, let me get you his name and number. Sometimes people really just stump you with a shocking question, and their telling all kinds of stuff as well, but I still feel uncomfortable with what they are asking.

      As I said, your discomfort seems to be personality driven.

      I think these people just consider it banter, but for me I want to conserve some info. I would usually just come out and say, I don’t feel comfortable with that question, but that got some anger stirred.

      Hmmmm. Well this type of response is awkward and is not acceptable in most casual social situations.

      Here’s an example of what I think you’re asking. Years ago, my ex-husband (a Nigerian) and I bought an acre of land and had a house built in an upscale 99.999% white development. The area was considered only affordable by those who had larger/professional incomes. Naturally, many of the whites there were totally shocked or at least curious as to how an ordinary looking BLACK couple like us could afford to live there. So they began to do their welcome-to-the-neighborhood bit by bringing over food. Of course, I understood that the main reason why they were so welcoming was because they wanted to do an INQUISITION. LOL! So this is the way it would usually go.

      White Person: Welcome to the neighborhood. You have a beautiful home. (The white person was usually a woman but sometimes it would be a ww and wm.)

      Me: Thank you! But boy is moving to a new house and getting it into shape a lot of work! Whew! (Here, I start the banter so that I can take charge.) Where’s your house located in the development?

      White person: It’s over there on such and such street/road.

      Me: How long have you lived here?

      White Person: We’ve been here for 3 years.

      Me: Oh, well I know you can tell us where to buy fresh fish in the area and where the best places to shop.

      White Person: Oh, you find such and such at such and such place.

      At this point, I would allow them to get in a question.

      White Person: Well, we passed by when you and your husband were moving in. Where does he work?

      (I don’t mind them asking me this. This is a normal, natural question. The type of work a man does tells others important info about him. A MAN is largely judged by his work, by what he PRODUCES and what he’s paid for what he produces.)

      Me: Oh he’s an accountant. (I chuckle here because I deliberately want to inject some lightness into the inquisition.) He’s one of those guys who follows the money trail.

      White Person: (Eyes light up in surprise but nods approvingly.)<Smiles) Maybe he can give us some tips around tax time.

      Me: (Smiles)Oh, don't even mention taxes! I hate to think about them. Where does your husband work? What do YOU do?

      Now, I could go on endlessly with this person, just chatting and engaging in normal banter. I could even inquisition them if I were interested.

      However, if the person were to cross a boundary as in:

      White Person: How much did you get your house for?

      Me: Too much, but you know how builders are. They get as much as they can. The land was probably cheaper when you bought your house. How much was an acre of land going for at that point that you got your house built?

      White Person: Well, my father had bought this land at the very beginning years ago before it was put into the hands of a realtor. I'm just curious as to what an acre is going for at this point–how much you paid for yours.

      Me: (evading their direct question and still being neighborly) Well, you know how land prices change everyday. If you know someone who wants to buy an acre out here now, tell them to look into the For Sale section of the newspaper and they will see what an acre of land is selling for in this development at this particular point because the market determines what an acre is going to sell for on any given day.

      *******************************

      The white person in this example is highly unlikely to try to pin me down beyond this point because they would be showing OBVIOUS rudeness and we would both know it.
      On the other hand, it's only normal and natural for them, you, or me to be curious about any new person who comes around/among us–because any new person is a STRANGER. However, this doesn't mean I'm going to allow anyone to cross my boundaries. I can use my verbal and social skills to keep them at a distance–forever. Some people may feel uncomfortable in this situation, but I didn’t because I would always take charge of the banter and direct it. You can choose to go on the defense sometimes, but it’s usually better to go on the offense as I did. No matter how intrusive the question might be, I simply wouldn’t answer it and would deflect by either asking them the same or similar question (all the while smiling/chuckling) or would point the conversation somewhere else.

      The bottom line is that if you mingle with people, you have to EXPECT them to talk to you. You can’t control what they say or ask you, but you can use what they say to direct the banter to a more comfortable place for you.

      • Oshun/Aphrodite says:

        Thank you for that example. I get questions like that latter all the time. That is very clever taking over the conversation and putting it back on them. I really appreciate the example.

      • ZooPath says:

        @Evia: *This* is the kind of help I need. How to gracefully deflect questions. Does one of you books address these type of social situations?

        • Evia says:

          @ZooPath–Glad to be of service. And yes, it has to be done gracefully in order to not shoot yourself in the foot and give yourself wiggle room. You can be friendly, sociable, and totally pleasant without saying anything you don’t want to say.

          My Vetting Men 101 newsletter (12 issues) focuses on vetting MEN and some of the knowledge, social skills and etiquette–needed for best results in that area–not on navigating social situations in general.

      • tertiaryanna says:

        “Ladies This is what I mean when I say repeatedly that AA women need a RUCOSS because an uplifting culture of some sort conveys at least the basics of how individuals can successfully address many of their various challenges and needs:”

        I learned quite a lot of social interaction and language skills from books and movies. That’s why it’s so poisonous to expose yourself to degrading art and culture. It’s like eating rotten food and trying to run a marathon.

        The good thing is that if you can apply a little imagination, you can see yourself in borrowing someone else’s uplifting culture (even if it wasn’t designed for BW in mind.) For example, a real BW would have had a dire life in the time of Charlotte Brontë, but it’s fiction, so I just extend a little artistic license and picture myself as the heroine.

  24. mochachoc says:

    Keeping it real has clearly not served BW well. The assumption is keeping it real demonstrates I am an authentic BW i.e; I am strong, outspoken, upfront and won’t let no one mess with me. BW think utilising other more subtle forms of feminine power is not for them. We don’t see that keeping it real renders us completely powerless. When we keep it real we become the shield and mouthpiece for everyone else, leaving us picking up the wounds. WW don’t position themselves as the loud, proud, fiesty big woman and they don’t get manouvered into being so by others. Yet how many times have I heard examples of BW recounting stories from work where they are the one’s to ‘speak up’ for the group or let off steam. As Evia mentioned we become entertainment fodder for others; paradoxically filling the role ascribed to us.

    I don’t think BW think of themselves as feminine. The dominant image of a feminine woman is a white, alabaster skinned, English rose or an Asian woman whose features can be described as delicate as a flower; the weaker sex. For the reasons we have discussed on several occasions Black women’s bodies tend not to lend themselves to those descriptions. Our bodies (I am generalising) are viewed as Amazonian, athletic, strong as a mule, dark i.e; not in need of masculine support. What we need to do is forget those lies about our bodies and tap into the power that has always been available to women. It isn’t in keeping it real, fighting verbally and physically nor in wearing a face so stern others wonder what’s up. We need to allow ourselves the grace to yield to femininity which for many of us feels quite alien. We don’t have the luxury not to if we want to survive and thrive.

    Re being indiscriminate with personal information. The therapy culture, letting it all hang out zeitgeist is largely a trap for BW. Other people use the dysfunctions many BW have experienced for titillation and entertainment. Worst still our dysfunctions is used against us. You may think telling someone about ‘the troubles you’ve seen’ will induce empathy but it usually doesn’t. Our pain is used to reinforce the negative beliefs others have of us in order to keep us in our place. As mentioned by Khadija several times, seek therapy with a professional for healing. You do, after all, want to retain one of the characteristics of a feminine woman – your mystique.

  25. mochachoc says:

    Hope it’s ok to post this link to photos of an unknown family. The women look like they had style, grace and were very feminine. I think it’s a good idea to see images of feminine Black women.

    Scroll down till you get to the black and white prints.

    http://thesartorialist.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2010-01-08T07%3A03%3A00-05%3A00&max-results=20

    • Hodan says:

      love Sartorialist, best fashion photographer around….specially since he tends to profile every day person on the street.

  26. pioneervalleywoman says:

    Mochachoc:

    I don’t think BW think of themselves as feminine. The dominant image of a feminine woman is a white, alabaster skinned, English rose or an Asian woman whose features can be described as delicate as a flower; the weaker sex. For the reasons we have discussed on several occasions Black women’s bodies tend not to lend themselves to those descriptions. Our bodies (I am generalising) are viewed as Amazonian, athletic, strong as a mule, dark i.e; not in need of masculine support. What we need to do is forget those lies about our bodies and tap into the power that has always been available to women. It isn’t in keeping it real, fighting verbally and physically nor in wearing a face so stern others wonder what’s up. We need to allow ourselves the grace to yield to femininity which for many of us feels quite alien. We don’t have the luxury not to if we want to survive and thrive.

    My reply:

    But here is the thing, in the mainstream culture, women who have athletic bodies can be admired and still be seen, by themselves and others, as feminine; in fact, it seems to be even celebrated. Think of the (non-black) women athletes, runners, soccer players who are athletic yet seen as feminine. And yet, are there black women athletes who are seen as less so? Is it about black women cultivating athleticism and a strength that is not seen as masculine? For example, there is a difference in being toned with excellent stamina and almost looking like a man…The former is seen as feminine, ie., that many non-bw who work out a lot aspire to..black women can aim for the same.

  27. Oshun/Aphrodite says:

    Re Evia: “Trust me. Whites have been socialized to be very comfortable with blacks performing those roles. Typical whites often become uncomfortable when blacks behave outside of those traditional roles. For ex., SOME whites think a black person is angry when a bw doesn’t behave like a jolly ‘Aunt Jemima’ or when a bm doesn’t behave like an ‘Amos and Andy’ or ‘Stepin Fetchit’ coon/buffoon.”

    Thank you for the clarity. My mother and other family members used to tell me something akin to this since I was a little girl, but it was more generalized.

    Re: Khadija
    “Factor#1: The man places HIGH value on her and on keeping her in his life.
    Factor#2: The man knows that the woman will most likely divorce and otherwise dump him if she ever finds out that he’s been unfaithful.
    Factor#3: The woman has not let herself go; she’s kept herself “flawless;” and so the man KNOWS that if she dumps him, she can fairly easily replace him with another comparable, and maybe a superior man.”

    Thank you Khadija. These three factors are missing key information that AAW and girls are never given. If anything there is indoctrination against this for BW and girls.

    Factor # 1 alone should make all BW immediately strike BM off their lists as potential mates as BM at best are indifferent to BW. I think BW get a lot of indoctrination that this is normal for the man in this case BM, to be indifferent to you and you must outcompete (other women etc) or prove yourself to him- in order to sway the man in order to overcome his indifference towards you. Perhaps this is what D. Cooper was referring to when she said she is puzzled that so many women think that their love or sex has magical powers. The game is rigged, BW never stood a chance bc so many BM don’t value BW (they want to use them, not esteem them) and women can’t change men. So perhaps this is a part (not discounting the huge gender imbalance and other issues) of the reason why the the bar sinks lower and lower for BM and BW are giving away everything including the kitchen sink to get one. And this starts young.

    Factor #2 – I can recall indoctrination being spread early and thick regarding this one. Going back to the “man will be a man” snatches of conversations I heard as a child, all the way up to TV/radio shows of a few years ago saying that as long as the man doesn’t openly disrespect you – whats the problem with de facto polygamy? Especially if he is paying the bills? There is a strong push for BW to tolerate infidelity. Older BW seem to prepare younger ones to expect this and I have noticed that lately that something is trying desperately to saturate the media that this is normal/par for the course in relationships/marriage.

    Factor number 3 – Again I think the same amount of indoctrination/campaigning taking place regarding BW and appearances. BW are criticized for their appearance on the surface, but BW are definitely not encouraged (outside these blogs) to be flawless. Little BGs are actively discouraged from exploring and developing their femininity in age appropriate socially acceptable ways like other girls are. For many Black folks enhancing your looks and cultivating feminine charm is considered fast. So for some, tamping down/downplaying this is a warped attempt at safety in BC. Also there is pushback from BM, BW, WW etc for adult BW if she changes herself in this way. She becomes high maintenance, materialistic, vain, and a host of other negatives – people especially BM – seek to put her in her place.

    For every factor you mentioned I can think of several lines of indoctrnation that start in youth which slowly track and derail BW away from everything you mentioned.

    I think that if BW could have the three things you mentioned drilled into their heads from an early age – they would definitely make other choices.

  28. {temporarily dipping back into the conversation}

    Oshun/Aphrodite,

    You’re welcome!

    You said, “Factor # 1 alone should make all BW immediately strike BM off their lists as potential mates as BM at best are indifferent to BW. I think BW get a lot of indoctrination that this is normal for the man in this case BM, to be indifferent to you and you must outcompete (other women etc) or prove yourself to him- in order to sway the man in order to overcome his indifference towards you. Perhaps this is what D. Cooper was referring to when she said she is puzzled that so many women think that their love or sex has magical powers. The game is rigged, BW never stood a chance bc so many BM don’t value BW (they want to use them, not esteem them) and women can’t change men.”

    Exactly! The game IS rigged against BW in the all-AA/Black dating/marriage scene. Most AA males are emotionally incapable of valuing any BW the way a woman should be valued in a marriage. So, it’s best for most marriage-minded AA women to bypass the vast majority of AA males.

    You said, “Factor #2 – I can recall indoctrination being spread early and thick regarding this one. Going back to the “man will be a man” snatches of conversations I heard as a child, all the way up to TV/radio shows of a few years ago saying that as long as the man doesn’t openly disrespect you – whats the problem with de facto polygamy? Especially if he is paying the bills? There is a strong push for BW to tolerate infidelity. Older BW seem to prepare younger ones to expect this and I have noticed that lately that something is trying desperately to saturate the media that this is normal/par for the course in relationships/marriage.”

    I agree; that’s why I hate that “men will be men” type of talk. To me, it’s the same as saying that because statistically a certain percentage of people will become dope fiends, a woman must accommodate herself to the possibility that her husband might become a dope fiend. Ummm…NO.

    Now, you can’t control other people’s behavior. But you can do your best to screen out men with certain known behaviors, and you can do your best to discourage the man you choose from covertly engaging in these same behaviors. Mostly by him knowing that the price tag of engaging in such behaviors is losing you—AND seeing you replace him with another man. If he values you the way you should seek to be valued, he’s less likely to risk that.

    A woman can’t respond to activities that she never finds out about. The flip side of that is that a man should have to work very hard to hide certain things from his wife IF he wants to keep her. Drug use is an example of that. Cheating is another example of that.

    I’ll also note that not all men cheat. Second, the goal is to try to find one who has the sort of internal ethical standards—in other words, a principled man—that make him NOT inclined to engage in that sort of behavior in general. Third, is to have all 3 of the factors I listed covered, so the man is highly motivated NOT to cheat.

    You said, “Factor number 3 – Again I think the same amount of indoctrination/campaigning taking place regarding BW and appearances. BW are criticized for their appearance on the surface, but BW are definitely not encouraged (outside these blogs) to be flawless. Little BGs are actively discouraged from exploring and developing their femininity in age appropriate socially acceptable ways like other girls are.”

    Yes, this is the unfortunate reality within the AA collective.

    You said, “For every factor you mentioned I can think of several lines of indoctrnation that start in youth which slowly track and derail BW away from everything you mentioned.”

    Yes, at each step AA women and girls are being steered into voluntary exploitation.

    You said, “I think that if BW could have the three things you mentioned drilled into their heads from an early age – they would definitely make other choices.”

    I agree. Spread the word! 🙂

    Expect Success!

  29. Evia says:

    Yes, at each step AA women and girls are being steered into voluntary exploitation.

    Khadija, I have to say that I think a lot AA women are all the more easily exploited as a result of their lack of awareness about their own shaping. There are lots of Quality, loving, and lovable (QLL) men out there, but lots of AA women are not attracted to them.

    I believe a lot more in-depth focus needs to be on why so few AA women find or are found by these Quality, loving and lovable (QLL) men???? It’s deeper than the fact that so many AA women stay or socialize mainly in black surroundings/social circles because many upwardly mobile AA women go to school with and work with non-AA men all of the time. They’re even at social venues where lots of these men are present, such as at jazz concerts, museums, out-door events, etc.

    I think many of those AA women cross the vast bulk of non-AA men off the list instantly if they were to be truthful about it. The question is does the typical WM, AM appeal to the typical AA woman? This is really a critical question. There is no point in these women claiming that they’re open to non-bm if these men don’t appeal to them because 98% of wm do not look like Brad Pitt and George Clooney.

    Whereas it has been shown/proven that a typical AA man will accept practically any ww of any shape, size, health status, personality, moral caliber, etc. as long as he’s able to detect her white skin shade, AA women are not like that at all when it comes to wm. This is really a part of this situation that is rarely discussed.

    I’ll be honest here and I KNOW I’m biased, but I’m not attracted to the typical Hispanic man no matter what since I’m repulsed by the MACHO element in some Hispanic cultures. Since the time I was a very young woman, that has always turned me off. I realize that there are many wonderful Hispanic men out there, but that macho element is repulsive to me and I wouldn’t want to put myself in a situation where it would be in my environment constantly. So, an Hispanic man would be the last man I would choose if I had a choice. I know I could be missing a lot, but knowing and feeling are 2 different things.

    I believe that a part of the reason many AA women are not finding QLL men in other races and ethnic groups is because of WHO they’re looking for or the type of men they find appealing or not finding appealing. If wm represent 80% of the physically available and possibly marriageable men in the country for SOME bw and many of these bw–down deep inside–are crossing off 98% of them, then where does that leave these women?

    For ex., as I’ve pointed out, MOST of the white men who ww and aw date, love, marry, and raise families with would not be found appealing by many AA women, based on what I’ve seen and heard. I’m just going by what I’ve seen and heard. At times, I’ve heard AA women make disparaging comments about the appeal of the husbands of many ww and some aw. I think that the general INDOCTRINATION of typical AA women has presented only a certain type of man as an appealing man and this man is mainly a “certain” type of AA man ONLY–tall, big, dark, muscular, with Swag or THE BUCK/Mandingo from the old plantation who was skilled in talking a woman’s underwear off–FAST. Sometimes, even a wm has to have some of these characteristics in order to be appealing to typical AA women.

    This is a problem that many AA women need to work on–fast, quick, and in a hurry!!!

    And wm are AWARE this!! Lots of wm make it their business to be aware of many things. Yet, so many bw will say that wm are not interested in them. This is like a cat chasing its tail!!

    I could be wrong, but I believe that collective memory among typical AA woman has passed the appeal of that type of BUCK-bm down through the generations to SOME present-day AA women. Thankfully, I’m not one of them.

    And this is mainly and fortunately an AA woman thing. I say that because I’ve observed the type of Nigerian men that typical Nigerian women find appealing and marry. They might like the tall man, but they do not discriminate against the shorter chubby, quiet, studious, balding etc. Nigerian man IF he brings the other important qualities and traits to the table. Many AA women simply want themselves that big ole BUCK. Period. And he can be a big, ole DUMB buck, at that. LOL! Over time, more AA men have been able to stretch the Buck’s appeal wider for more of them to fit into, but this really presents a problem for AA women.

    • Evia,

      You said, “I think many of those AA women cross the vast bulk of non-AA men off the list instantly if they were to be truthful about it. The question is does the typical WM, AM appeal to the typical AA woman? This is really a critical question. There is no point in these women claiming that they’re open to non-bm if these men don’t appeal to them because 98% of wm do not look like Brad Pitt and George Clooney.

      Whereas it has been shown/proven that a typical AA man will accept practically any ww of any shape, size, health status, personality, moral caliber, etc. as long as he’s able to detect her white skin shade, AA women are not like that at all when it comes to wm. This is really a part of this situation that is rarely discussed.

      …I think that the general INDOCTRINATION of typical AA women has presented only a certain type of man as an appealing man and this man is mainly a “certain” type of AA man ONLY–tall, big, dark, muscular, with Swag or THE BUCK/Mandingo from the old plantation who was skilled in talking a woman’s underwear off–FAST. Sometimes, even a wm has to have some of these characteristics in order to be appealing to typical AA women.”

      I agree. And this preference for “Buck” the plantation breeding stud—as in modern-day “Buck Wild”—buck wildly inrresponsible, buck wildly stupid—is so profoundly backwards that it’s breathtaking in its stupidity.

      A woman who is only capable of responding favorably to “Buck the Breeding Stud” is a woman who thinks likes a broodmare. And not like a normal, healthy woman. Certainly not a woman of any quality. Healthy women and definitely quality women evaluate men across SEVERAL attributes, not just on how buff their bodies are, and not just on how handsome their faces are.

      I’ll also add that AA women only come up with these “but he’s not ‘Buck'” requirements with nonblack men. Anybody who spends an afternoon in an urban child support courtroom will see evidence that AA women will sex and have babies by balding, out of shape to downright Heavy D-sized, elderly, definitely “not Buck” types of BM.

      You said, “This is a problem that many AA women need to work on–fast, quick, and in a hurry!!!”

      Indeed!

      Expect Success!

    • IRockIRoll says:

      I don’t want to speak for anyone else, but in my experience a good portion of black women who say that they are not attracted to white men aren’t… until their friend is dating a white man. My thought process is that they are usually lying from the get-go, but simply didn’t see white men as an option. I haven’t gone on more than two dates with Indian men, but I don’t sit around talking about how I’m NOT attracted to the majority of them. If these women are sitting around talking about men that they “wouldn’t” date constantly, I’d have my eyebrow up. You don’t talk about something that doesn’t cross your mind often. I chalk this up to a few factors, but mainly two.

      1) Fear of rejection.
      2) Internalization of masculinity.

      As for 1), I’ll bring up a college example. The majority of my friends weren’t black, but I was/am definitely friends with several black women. I went to a majority white school, and I liked to go out so I was definitely social. One night while studying in the library (all black women), the discussion turned to dating, and someone mentioned my white male dates. I wasn’t the only one who had gone out on dates with white men, or had no issues socializing with them, but one young woman from a majority/all black neighborhood/environment was VERY against dating white men. She only wanted a brother with “swagger”. Yada Yada Yada. And then towards the end of the night, she figured that “maybe” she would date a white man if there were no other options. Cut to a year later (we were no longer friends, just major/class associates, she beat up another girl in a parking lot and I was NOT into being lumped into that kind of rep) and GUESS who had a white boyfriend? Well… it turns out that she had been v. jealous of me and the others who were NOT waiting on the “good brothers” to call us back on the phone and going out with whoever asked and was cute (hey, it was college). It turns out that after being around all black environments, she wasn’t confident that she was a pretty woman with lots to offer, and was deathly afraid of white men rejecting her if she had ever seemed interested. Her reasoning was that they had Beckys and Mei Lings and Conchitas around to pick from – and if BLACK men didn’t think she was pretty, then how would men with more options chose her over the other types of women. After seeing other black women date out, her fear of rejection rolled back a bit. All of this, “pink body parts”, and wet-dog stuff goes out of the WINDOW once people see you out and about with your boyfriend. Rejecting white men out of the gate saves a lot of people mental energy on who is helping to drag down our image and collective at the moment.

      2) All this talk about wanting a man with swagger is b/c black women have had to put on such a masculine front in so many majority black environments. That want for “swagger” is a want to be able to act LIKE A WOMAN. But since we as a group are being socialized to act like men, then the “hunt” for a good man is placed WAY out of wack, and someone who is projecting physical toughness (projecting is usually all that’s going on) becomes more valuable than is needed. So many black women are divorced from their femininity because we don’t have a community that allows women to exist safely without being targeted for being a woman. This “swagger” also seems to be a trait assigned to darker skinned black men. I’ve heard multiple darker skinned women state out loud that they could never date a light-skinned black man b/c they’re too feminine. Now, we’re all allowed preferences etc… but usually when I hear that statement the woman has all kinds of issues with having been masculinized in black environments due to her skin shade and refuses to see or acknowledge that she is feminizing a lighter skin tone while assigning masculine characteristics to a darker one. Once you start catching it in conversation it is OBVIOUS. An older friend was dating this PUNK, punk.punk.punk, but because he was darker, and had swag, he was the man… until he needed to borrow some money from her. Meanwhile a lighter skinned guy (and is dating someone else now) who always took care of business was dismissed b/c “you know how them light-skinned dudes be all Al B.Shore-like”. SMH.

      All those times that you hear black women say, “That’s for white women”, needs to be turned around to, “Why is it assumed that I can’t have that too?”. Because for real, white women are living pretty well in this country, so I don’t see anything bad about wanting that standard of treatment for ME. Yes, there is racism, yes there is history, but at a certain point in time we’ve got to move on.

      • IRock, IRoll,

        You said, “I’ve heard multiple darker skinned women state out loud that they could never date a light-skinned black man b/c they’re too feminine. Now, we’re all allowed preferences etc… but usually when I hear that statement the woman has all kinds of issues with having been masculinized in black environments due to her skin shade and refuses to see or acknowledge that she is feminizing a lighter skin tone while assigning masculine characteristics to a darker one. Once you start catching it in conversation it is OBVIOUS.”

        That’s scary. From what you’re saying, darker-skinned BW with this type of mindset are basically buying into the Yung Berg slave mentality and agreeing with the slave plantation/hip-hop video-based brainwashing that says:

        1-Lighter, Whiter women are somehow inherently more feminine; and

        2-that they themselves are unwomen and shemales.

        Foul, foul, foul…

        You said, “Yes, there is racism, yes there is history, but at a certain point in time we’ve got to move on.”

        Since it’s been okay for BM to have already moved on, then it’s certainly okay for BW to take a page from BM’s playbook and also move on.

        Expect Success!

      • Evia says:

        THANK YOU, IRockIRoll for this exposee! LOL! You have said a mouthful!

        Re:
        in my experience a good portion of black women who say that they are not attracted to white men aren’t… until their friend is dating a white man. My thought process is that they are usually lying from the get-go,

        This has certainly been confirmed in my experience and in all 100% of the cases. ALL of the single bw who claimed to be outraged at me for marrying Darren have changed their tune totally and are now stating that they’re interested in dating wm. ALL of them–and some have done so. One even married a wm last year. SMH Bw need to just stop with this farce because they’re not getting ANY younger.

      • ak says:

        IRockIRoll:

        All those times that you hear black women say, “That’s for white women”, needs to be turned around to, “Why is it assumed that I can’t have that too?”.

        Yes, yes, YES! This has always been my fight, and this is why I can’t understand why BW can’t question themselves or others about this. I have always felt alone because of the tendencies a lot of BW have of ‘othering’ themselves in their thought processes from the things that all other non-black women get for themselves, as has been stated plenty of times on most of the BWE blogs.

    • ak says:

      Evia:

      I’ll be honest here and I KNOW I’m biased, but I’m not attracted to the typical Hispanic man no matter what since I’m repulsed by the MACHO element in some Hispanic cultures.

      I think I know what you mean a lot of cultures of men such as the Italian, and certain African cultures have the machismo element in them, where the men think their God’s gift, and expect to be served and mothered all the time. I avoid any man from any culture that gives me a wiff of the fact that he’s ‘full of himself’.

    • ak says:

      Evia:

      I could be wrong, but I believe that collective memory among typical AA woman has passed the appeal of that type of BUCK-bm down through the generations to SOME present-day AA women. Thankfully, I’m not one of them.

      I’m not one of em either. I hate swagger with a passion.

    • Zoopath says:

      I think you touched on a big ‘ol “elephant in the room, so to speak. Waaaay too many BW place value on qualities that have little to no bearing on the long-term success of a marriage/relationship. It’s so, so tragic. My personal example is of a family friend who fell in love with a quality BM who treated her well but he wasn’t that tall. However, she broke it off with him because her mother said that she didn’t pay for all the pageants/enrichments activities for her daughter to end up with some short man. The guy was taller than her but just not super tall. So, they broke it off and she married a tall, handsome, black lawyer and the marriage ended very badly (accusations of voodoo, I kid you not) after 2 years and she’s a single mom, now. That was a bad call, to say the least. My personal rule was that the guy just had to be taller than me (I’m short so it’s not often an issue) and he could be the same height if he were super-high earning.

    • Faith says:

      Yes, doesn’t the Big Black Brute/Mandingo/Buck stereotype permeate the AA collective’s consciousness? It’s why so many BM brag about the supposed larger size of their members and how that myth is a draw to non-black women as well.

      If you think about it isn’t this usually the image of black males across all fronts: hyper – something? If everthing is an exaggeration there’s no chance for a normal image to shine through.

      It’s all about the good time but they’re not to be taken seriously because they cant be serious. Racism, lack of jobs, the women not letting them be men and all manner of other excuses are always at fault for stopping them from doing anything productive except for bragging about how great they are/what they’re going to do **when**.

      • IRockIRoll says:

        Good-tyme Johnny is right indeed Faith. Frankly, I think the reason why it is so hyped, is because that is the one myth that has done black men any favors. Lord knows the other “reputational aspects” aren’t so flattering. That’s actually an example of taking a stereotype that works “for” you, and letting THAT kind of reputation get out to act in your favor. I.E. Asian women going along with submissiveness when needed, white women going along with “nice girl/Princess” when needed. All of the positive aspects of American Black women have been SHOVED from the national picture, while “Keeping it Real” chicks from the hood have been showcased. If anyone had any questions about how bad the keeping it real trickbag is, then look at the current images shown of black women in America, and then look at how rarely we are defended as women. Other people’s perceptions can sometimes shape your realities. You certainly don’t see attractive MARRIED Black American women on T.V. like you did in the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s.

  30. LaJane Galt says:

    whats the problem with de facto polygamy? Especially if he is paying the bills? There is a strong push for BW to tolerate infidelity.

    Oshun, I want to add that it’s not just hand me down misinformation that pushes polygamy. This has been given academic imprimatur at HBCUs, one in particular… I listened to such lectures in the 90s while visiting Morehouse. This POV was cloaked in “nationalist” language and repeated inside and outside of the classroom. It was put forth by professors, not just students. Only visiting female students challenged this bs. The cream of the crop/not Ray-Rays were silent.

    **
    Evia~thanks for that breakdown of a typical conversation with a white neighbor. I grew up in that type of environment and remembered the cordial, casual, yet distant way my mom would deal with WW. She was never shy about explaining to me the underlying goal of those conversations. Is it “fair”? No. But it is what it is.

    These kinds of situations can be annoying and stressful for any BW, doubly so for those who really haven’t been around people who don’t look like them.

    Personally, I think keep it real is a defense mechanism used to appear in control of a situation where one is truly lost/feels powerless.

    Unfamiliarity + this stressor – lack of intelligent way of responding –> “keep it real” mode.

    • IRockIRoll says:

      Keeping it Real is exactly that – a defense mechanism for when someone doesn’t know the “rules” of wherever they are, KIR can be used as a fallback to blackness and your PERSONAL lack of knowledge or decorum doesn’t have to be addressed b/c you’re being black right now. In my own experience, I’ve seen people suddenly act “hood” when in majority white or upscale environments that they were unfamiliar with. Instead of observing what other people’s behavior patterns were, they became very defensive. There is one person who I no longer attend ANY sort of formal function with anymore. We were out and about both looking for additional people to go out with, and meet men socially. Well… cue going to a nice place (I’d been out with her before to upscale restaurants, but that was in a larger group, this was just us) and her acting a FOOL as soon as a good-looking man came over to talk. She’d seemed nervous when we sat down at the bar, but I didn’t realize before that the size of previous dinner parties (4-8) had allayed nervousness in certain environments. To put it lightly, I ended up calling it a night fairly soon. On the way back to the car she admitted that she was really uncomfortable without any other black people around (we were two of like 3-4 in the restaurant) in that kind of place and wanted to feel more relaxed. So she decided to Keep.It.Real after multiple stares to stop and foot taps. Which is why I haven’t been out with her since. This keeping it real allows folks to “scoot past” learning certain formalities, but in the end it simply makes BW look uncouth. A little grace ain’t never hurt nobody.

  31. Oshun/Aphrodite says:

    @LaJane

    “Oshun, I want to add that it’s not just hand me down misinformation that pushes polygamy. This has been given academic imprimatur at HBCUs, one in particular… I listened to such lectures in the 90s while visiting Morehouse. This POV was cloaked in “nationalist” language and repeated inside and outside of the classroom. It was put forth by professors, not just students. Only visiting female students challenged this bs. The cream of the crop/not Ray-Rays were silent.”

    I can’t believe that it goes back that far. I suppose that fits since BM have always had their agenda.

  32. Pat says:

    My sister sent me a link to an article about how to keep a man. It was that same ole 90 day rule, make him chase you bullsh*t! [Khadija speaking: Explicit profanity is NOT welcome at this blog. I edited the curse word. This time. Sometimes I refuse to publish entire comments instead of taking the time to edit out profanity.] What these dumb clucks dont realize is if a man does not value you FUNDAMENTALLY, if he is INDIFFERENT to you, he will do everything that he needs to do just to get you and after he conquers you he will act a fool. I met a girl recently who waited a year to sleep with her boyfriend and as sooooon as he got it he let her go. Why??? Because although she was a smart, gorgeous attorney…he was a smart gorgeous successful black man and she was a dime a dozen. That is why sisters go around in circles over and over…. THEY JUST DONT GET IT!!!